AMD Promises Full Radeon GPU Lineup Refresh in 2019

Subject: Graphics Cards | January 11, 2019 - 04:35 PM |
Tagged: video cards, Vega VII, Vega, Refresh, radeon, Mark Papermaster, graphics, gpus, cto, amd, 7nm

AMD CTO Mark Papermaster spoke with The Street in a video interview published yesterday, where he made it clear that we can indeed expect a new Radeon lineup this year. “It’s like what we do every year,” he said, “we’ll round out the whole roadmap”.

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Part of this refresh has already been announced, of course, as Papermaster noted, “we’re really excited to start on the high end” (speaking about the Radeon VII) and he concluded with the promise that “you’ll see the announcements over the course of the year as we refresh across our Radeon roadmap”. It was not mentioned if the refreshed lineup will include 7 nm parts derived from the Vega VII shown at CES, but it seems reasonable to assume that we haven’t seen the last of Vega 2 in 2019.

Source: The Street

January 11, 2019 | 05:28 PM - Posted by RefreshAwayWith7nmVega20DieHarvestingAndNewerNavi7nmAlso (not verified)

Full lines of higher end Radeon/7nm GPUs that are just even lower binned Variants of those 7nm Vega 20 DIEs. That's because AMD's Vega 20 Wafer/DIE production via TSMC/7nm has been ongoing for some months and there is built up DIE/Bins full of defective/non-performant Vega 20 DIE's!

So That includes any Non-Performant Vega 20 DIEs that may have fully working complements of nCUs but use too much Power or run to hot for Pro/Server usage metrics. And they can not be used for any MI50s/60s or Radeon Pro WX Profesional GPU production. So that's loads of Vega 20 DIEs that are just waiting to be harvested for consumer Radeon VII and Lower binned Vega 20 Die based "Vega-2"/Radeon-7nm variants. There are bound to be Vega 20 DIEs that have insufficent working shaders to even be considered for the just announced Radeon VII, so even lower end Vega 20/Consumer variants are a no brainer.

AMD really may not have to get Navi pushed out for the desktop as quickly beacuese of 7nm/Vega-20 binned consumer variants but Navi for any discrete mobile GPUs will be needed, some Navi/Mainstream also. But if there can be at least Radeon VII and 1 or 2 lower binned consumer Vega 20 based GPU SKUs with one matching Vega 56's Shader:TMU:ROP metrics but with better performance and one a little lower well it's better than tossing any Vega 20 DIEs in the trash.

So AMD can refresh its Radeon Vega high end SKUs at 7nm from harvested Vega 20 DIEs and Navi comes in later in the year to finish off the GPU product portfolio for mainstream, lower end desktop Radeon GPU variants, and even Navi/Discrete Mobile variants also.

There is currently only limited first generation Vega discrete mobile variants/4GB-HBM2 that Apple is making use of in their macbooks and that so called "Vega" Discrete mobile semi-custom variant on Intel's Kaby Lake G Brandad EMIB/MCM SKUs.

Yes AMD can refresh Radeon partially for the Desktop with harvested 7nm/Vega 20 GPU DIE bins and fill out the mainstream/lower end Desktop GPU SKUs, and newer Discrete Mobile GPUs, with Navi based offerings.

Hell I'd really like to see 14nm/12nm Vega discrete mobile/4GB-HBM2 offerings for the Non-Apple Laptop market also. That's especially because that 4GB HBM2 Die on Vega Discrete Mobile can be turned into a last level GPU cache to a larger pool of virtual VRAM pooled To/From system DRAM by Vega's HBCC/HBC IP. Laptop/Mobile GPUs really can benefit more form Vega's HBCC/HBC IP than Desktop GPUs that usually come with 8GB+ VRAM options.

January 11, 2019 | 06:50 PM - Posted by chipman (not verified)

In other words AMD has a lot of 7 nm Vega garbages to sell... stockholders should be happy! L O L

January 11, 2019 | 07:38 PM - Posted by ChipManChildAgain (not verified)

Not really! Nvidia had plenty of GP102 DIEs coming of the diffusion lines with defective Cuda Cores/SMs and Nvidia created a consumer bottom GP102 DIE based binned SKU, the GTX 1080Ti made from harvested from the worse case GP102 DIEs!

But chipman is actually chipmanchild and is so emotional engendered to one GPU maker over the other for illogical reasons!

Did AMD violate your nether regions in the past, are you not a little bit like Peter Griffin after that proctological exam! What's up with your pathological need to bash one GPU maker over the other.

I'm sure that Radeon VII will perform a little better at 7nm with all the aditional tweaks, even with it's now confermed 64(Not 128) ROPs. That's the same number of ROPs that the RTX 2080 still has.

What you should be mad about is the Technology Press afraid to ask about Vega 20's xGMI and other Tweaks because of that viral marketing that's infested the high technology CPU/GPU makers these days. Let's keep the consumers hungry for that information and speculating all over the interwebs until that information is released a little at the time to keep the new GPU's name fresh in the minds of potential consumers.

Look at Nvidia and GP104 die harvesting to create GTX 1060s in addition to useing GP106 for GTX 1060 production. AMD and Intel Die harvest and bin for lower variants also.

I like Nvidia's RTX IP both the RT cores and the Tensor Cores but I'm not about to touch the RTX 2060 until Blender 3D can fully make use of those RTX/Turing RT cores. And that's a good while off unless Nvidia donates some funds to the Blender foundation to get Blender's code refactored for CUDA 10 and the new RT/Tensor Core IP's Cuda 10 API calls.

I'm not spending Thousands on Maya/other expensive software just to get at RTX/Truing's RT/Tensor cores. I could afford 2 Radeon VIIs and the PC/CPU/MB/ETC to make them work for the cost of some of those non open source 3D graphics packages/subscription over time.

AMD has announced that they are also beginning the Ray Tracing in hadrware development process. Thank You Imagination Technologies for your PowerVR Wizard Hardware Ray Tracing IP that started the process all off. Nvidia sure is not the leader that started hardware ray tracing off but at least they are ahead of AMD and forcing AMD, and probably Intel's, hands also!

All that New and Shiny is worthless until the Games/More affordable Graphics software can mke use of that New and Shiny. So Nvidia's RT cores and AMD's Explicit Primitive Shaders have to have explicit API and or Driver support and the software(Gaming/Graphics/Other) has to be refactored to support that New and Shiny. And until then that New and Shiny is essentially worthless.

January 11, 2019 | 10:48 PM - Posted by chipman (not verified)

Dude are you from a third world country? It seems the case since you're willing to pay the least for any product like chips from AMD or free softwares...

Uncle $crooge you've been unmasked! :o)

January 12, 2019 | 12:09 AM - Posted by LetTheFoolsBleedTheirDoshForBleedingEdge (not verified)

I'm still using an AMD Terscale Micro-Arch GPU in my laptop, I have no reason to update currently but Nvidia's RTX Product is still too unsupported in software for me to be interested.

I could not give a rats A$$ about gaming so whatever works with the software that I use at the more affordable price point is what I will purchase.

My laptop was a previous years model purchased new at a discout price and that's the way my PC purchasing will be. I will let the fools rush in and pay for bleeding edge pricing and that's even more so for any new Technology that's not yet having full software support of any new and shiny.

I do not need real time ray tracing and non real time ray tracing can be done on any Nvidia or AMD GPUs of the last 5+ generations on Blender 3D.

Uncle $crooge got those piles of gold doubloons to swim through precisely because he avoided Bleeding Edge and let the Fools Rush in to quickly amortize the GPU maker's R&D cost. I have no piles of gold doubloons but I'll still wait for the technology to become more adopted before I'll even take a looksee. I never purchase this years technology until the software support ducks are fully in order and it's best to wait for it to become at least one year old and show up still in shrinkwrapped/brand new condition on fire sale at Microcenter!

I do like AMD's price/performance metrics and open source software support because Nvidia's pricing it a bit too high. But you know with Nvidia increasing it's GPU's MSRPs/ASPs, well, that's good for AMD also! That allows AMD to come in and get closer to Nvidia's pricing and profit more and then AMD's prices will usually begin to fall quicker than Nvidia's. That good for AMD at product introduction to get closer to Nvidia's pricing because that means in a years time AMD's GPU pricing will fall fruther after AMD fully Amortizies its GPU R&D development prices using the same fools that rush in to get any bleeding edge GPU/Other technology. AMD is a lower Overhead Business operation so Radeon VII's ASP in a years time will be much lower than Nvidia's GPU ASPs that tend to stay at inflated Pricing much longer.

Those Vega 20 DIE rejects are still fine for Consumer/Gaming and it's still better for AMD instead of tossing any Non-Performant/Defective Vega 20 DIEs in the rubbage bin. Maybe AMD will be saving up any Vega 20 dies that have even less working nCUs for some Dual Vega 20 DIEs/Single PCIe card consumer/gaming variant. And AMD has already created a Dual Vega 10 die based SKU for the Cloud Game Streaming market that uses 2 Vega 10 DIES that are binned down to Vega 56 like Shaders:TMU:ROP metric. So a Dual Vega 20 consumer Vega 20 variant on a single PCIe 4.0 enabled PCIe card and double the Shaders:TMUs:ROPs.

Vega 20 actually has only 64 ROPs and not 128, Anandtech got in wrong! But AMD will be making Dual Radeon MI##/and Radeon Pro WX variants at some point in time just like AMD currently has its Radeon V340 Dual Vega 10 GPU DIEs/Single PCIe card offering. I'm sure that all the TSMC/Vega 20 DIE production will have its share of Die Runts that AMD will be able to bin out into some Dual GPU DIEs/Single PCIe card Consumer/Gaming variant to take on the RTX 2080TI. It's just a matter of time before more Vega 20 runt DIEs fill up the bins that can not even be used for Radeon VII production.

And Vega 20 supports xGMI(Infinity Fabric) so that's a better way to wire up 2 GPU DIEs on a single PCIe card. And AMD probably will not GIMP any xGMI features on its consumer variants. Nvidia's NVLink is gimped to only working like a faster SLI bridge link on Nvidia's consumer RTX variants. So 2 Vega 20 Runt DIEs with each Runt DIE still having at least the same numbers of Shaders:TMUs:ROPs similar to Vega 56's Shader:TMU:ROP counts that will be doubled up on a single PCIe card and speak Infinity Fabric and scaling better than any PCIe Protocol could support and that is possible with xGMI.

chipmanchild you are looking very much like you have chizow's hand shoved up your nether region. Better take better care of those hot glued on googly eyes they tend to come of in the wash! What ever happend to N7SphincterElite, he dissappeared after he had his nuclear meltdown!

January 11, 2019 | 08:28 PM - Posted by Wall Street (not verified)

This may actually be the last that we see of Vega 20. The remainder of the lineup is expected to be Navi, but not until much later in the year.

January 11, 2019 | 09:42 PM - Posted by Anonymous11 (not verified)

The Nerdism is real... what do you guys expect in a software off year, some ray traced hentai running in VR?

January 11, 2019 | 11:50 PM - Posted by ADam Cole (not verified)

AMD has announced that they are also beginning the Ray Tracing in hadrware development process. Thank You Imagination Technologies for your PowerVR Wizard Hardware Ray Tracing IP that started the process all off. Nvidia sure is not the leader that started hardware ray tracing off but at least they are ahead of AMD and forcing AMD, and probably Intel's
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January 12, 2019 | 09:51 AM - Posted by GoTheFAwaywuthThat (not verified)

Really trying to slip some S P A M in there with that Google hot link, not 2nd hotlink but the first one that's got "write-my-essay" at the end of the google link!

The Above Post is:

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January 12, 2019 | 02:57 AM - Posted by Power (not verified)

Hopefully Nvidia follows suite and drops underwhelming raytracing when they shrink 2000 series to 7nm.

January 12, 2019 | 05:53 AM - Posted by tessallatedantialiasedandputawayraytraced (not verified)

Jensen would beg to differ my friend... https://youtu.be/dQw4w9WgXcQ

January 12, 2019 | 10:40 AM - Posted by AMDHasx86sServerMarketTAMtoLookForwardToInAdditionToGPUs (not verified)

JHH is pissed off about the Share Price on his Company Falling like Quebert after the cubes have been bathed in chicken fat.

And The same thing happend to AMD's stock but really AMD lost so much less in billions of share holder value. And Nvidia's got more to be worried about what with most of Nvidia's Business Model built around GPUs!

AMD has its x86 lines and those 64 core Epyc/Rome MCM/Chiplet based CPU SKUs will bring in the same kind of handsome markups as a Nvidia Quadro GPUs. So thoes Zen-2 based Epyc/Rome CPU Dies/Chiplets at 7nm are really coming off of TSMC's difussion lines with even higher Die/Wafer yields than the first generation Zen/Zeppelin Dies that where Fabbed on GF's(Licensed from Samsung) 14nm process node.

Good Golly Miss Molly those Zen-2 die chiplets are even smaller and pack more Cache on all Cache levels at 7nm plus bigger AVX and other tweaks! And to add to that space savings all the I/O circuitry is on the 14nm I/O die so the TSMC wafers must have double the numbers of Zen-2 Die/Chiplets and then some because they do not have to host memoty channels or the other I/O related IP!

AMD will soon be more profitable behind server market CPU revenues than Nvidia will be selling GPUs! And then AMD has its 7nm Vega 20 Die Bins that have been filling up with lower binned Vega 20 Dies that are perfect for doubling up on a single PCIe card with each binned Vega 20 die haveing the same numbers of Shaders:TMUs:ROPs as a Vega 56. So as as result of some months of Vega 20 Die production it's a no brainer to figure out that there are probably some number of Vega 20 Die binns that do not have even sufficient numbers of working shaders/nCU working to even bin out into Radeon VII.

So if one looks to the past and the present AMD already makes a dual Vega 10/single PCIe card V340 SKU that's made using a Vega 56's complement of Shaders:TMUs:ROPs on each die. So that's Vega 56 times 2 for the V340 and a specilized Virtulization ASIC also there to handle in hardware the GPU's Virtulization tasks.

AMD is also takeing Integrated Graphics market share and that Market's TAM is large in the Consumer/Business PC/Laptop markets. Then add in the Professional GPU compute/AI and visualization markets and that's more TAM for Red.

Folks are making a mistake thinking that Vega 20 had no ROPs/Need for ROPs even if the GPU card has no display outputs! Visulation workloads do still need ROPs and the Frames can be delivered headlessly for any supercomputer workloads to a workstation that's interfaced into the GPU Clusters and can disply that headlessly generated Cluster output to an 8k monitor. So Vega 20 was always designed with those 64 ROPs as there will at some point in time more than MI50s/60s making use of that Vega 20 Base Die tapeout. There will be Radeon Pro WX variants derived from Vega 20 that have loads of display outputs for any Pro Graphics "WX" variants also in addition to the Radeon VII Consumer/Gaming variant.

Don't you folks ever see those Tornado simulations or Galactic evloution visulations that are generated on GPUs that lack any disply output ports. There are thousands of GPUs on thos supercomputers and their Shader:TMU:ROP output is all sent to a graphics workstation headlessly and the Graphics Workstation reassembles the Cluster GPUs output and The Graphics Workstation's GPU/s have plenty of video output ports.

Vega 20 still needs ROPs if its also going to be used for Radeon Pro WX SKUs and Consumer Binned Radeon VIIs in addition to MI50's/60s. Really r/amd is good for pleny of laughs for one and all just watching the Bubba's trip up and embarrass themselves with their total lack of inductive and deductive reasoning skills.

January 12, 2019 | 05:58 AM - Posted by Othertomperson (not verified)

God I hope he means Navi, not rebranding the RX 480 a THIRD time.

January 12, 2019 | 06:19 AM - Posted by foolmeonceshameonyoufoolmetwiceshameonmefoolmethriceSKYLAKE! (not verified)

hey...you know what they say, third times a charm. and besides, if intel can do it, why not Am..ahem, i mean Radeon Technology Group?

January 12, 2019 | 02:04 PM - Posted by SomeSpecialTSMC7nmDealForRed (not verified)

Do you really think that Nvidia's Shader Core/SM designs were that much different generation to generation since Maxwell but before Volta/Turing. AMD could very well take Polaris to 7nm and get higher FPS metrics.

AMD's not going to be out spending Nvidia anytime soon on GPU R&D and numbers of specilized GPU Base Die Tapeouts. And You will pay more to play on Nvidia's latest RTX/Turing SKUs.

AMD does not really have to give a damn about Consumer Gaming GPUs because of AMD's x86 business alone will soon even dwarf Nvidia's GPU revenue streams in comparsion. AMD has had TSMC banging out those Vega 20 GPU DIEs by the Wafer for a good while and the yields are a bit higher owing to the relatively smaller size of the Vega 20 Die at 7nm. So the fab process for any processor is not perfect and that Vega 20 based Radeon VII is the result.

How long of a time do you think it will take before some Dual Vega 20/Single PCIe card appears made from harvested Vega 20 DIEs. There are bound to be some Vega 20 Die binns without sufficient working Shader cores or nCUs to even be made into Radeon VIIs. So AMD probably has some Binned Vega 20 DIE Binns full with DIEs that are very similar to Vega 56's metrics in total working Shaders:TMUs:ROPs! Vega 20 Die binns that are just waiting to be mounted 2 at a time to a simgle PCIe card beacuse what elese can AMD do with some 7nm Vega 20 DIEs that have even less available nCUs/shaders than even Radeon VII.

Those Vega 20 DIEs may also not meet the pro/server metrics for lower power usage so they will not be made into any Radeon Pro WX professional graphics SKUs or Compte/AI SKUs.
That means that as the result of the imperfect fab difussion processes there are going to be built up plenty of Vega 20 Dies to update on 7nm some Vega 56 like GPU SKUs on even a dual GPU/Single PCIe Card Flagship that's faster than the RTX 2080TI in raster oriented gaming.

AMD probably wants to end as much Vega 10 die production as possible and move that over to Vega 20 die production at 7nm and more Dies/Wafer with the Bins of consumer grade Vega 20 GPU DIEs replacing most all of AMD's GF/Vega 10 output. Navi will get there when Navi gets there so what does AMD's current roadmap state. Radeon VII is not performing too poorly and 16GB of HBM2 is great for anyone doing content creation in addition to gaming. I'm just waiting for some Prosumer Dual Vega 20 Die on a silgle PCIe card variant to show up because AMD has done that several times in the past.

I'm more curious about Vega 20's xGMI(Infinity Fabric) dual GPU bridge IP that may or may not make it into the consumer market. That xGMI is AMD's answer to Nvidia's NVLink so who knows how 2 Radeon VIIs may scale compared to the RTX 2080TI that costs nearly twice as much a single Radeon VII. For sure there will be a lower binned Vega 20 based Variant that's going be slotted in to replace Vega 56.

Maybe AMD could fruther die harvest below that and only use 4, 2GB HBM2 stacks. But who knows what AMD has decided based apon the total numbers of Vega 20 DIEs that have built up that can not be used for any professional SKUs or even the Radeon VII. Maybe an interim replacement for one mainstream priced Vega 20 based variant that's even lower binned with limited HBM2 amounts.

AMD sure wants to more fully transition over to 7nm and TSMC may have some excess 7nm cacapity to fill so they made AMD an offer that made it worth it for AMD.

Apple's iPhone production has sure reached Peak, iPad production also. Apple charges too much for its Macbook SKUs with those 2 Vega discrete mobile/4GB-HMB2 variants. So maybe AMD could get Vega Discrete Mobile Transitioned to 7nm/TSMC also and Apple's the only one making use of any Discrete Vega Mobile/4GB HBM2 SKU and those variants appear to be OEM(Apple) exclusive.

TSMC's got to be hurting for lost iPhone SOC production and Lost iPad SOC production at 7nm. That's what has me suspecting that AMD may be accelerating some Vega/7nm production while any special TSMC offer stands!

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