More testing of Mantle's mettle

Subject: General Tech | July 16, 2014 - 04:16 PM |
Tagged: gaming, Mantle, battlefield 4, BF4

Mantle is currently supported by the Nitrous, Frostbite 3 and CRYENGINE engines, and the current official list of released or soon to be released games that support the new API has reached eight AAA titles.  eTeknix lined up three of these games to test, Battlefield 4, Thief and PvZ Garden Warfare to test on an R9 290X paired with both a AMD FX-8350 and an FX-4100.   For BF4 with the Ultra preset, no V-Sync @ 1920 x 1080 both systems saw a noticeable jump in performance and Thief even more so for the FX8350 system.  Check out the full results in their review.

Don't forget to enable your team up with the Fragging Frogs while playing BF4, there is still a screenshot contest going on.

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"The biggest claim to fame of this new low-overhead API is its use in EA’s Battlefield 4 blockbuster and the support it has from EA’s famous FrostBite 3 Engine. However, what is all the fuss about? How does Mantle actually perform in practice? Why should you even care about it? These are questions we are hoping to address today."

Here is some more Tech News from around the web:


Source: eTeknix

July 16, 2014 | 04:53 PM - Posted by P0ci (not verified)

Intresting. So, Mantle is basically also forcing games to use more threads despite them not doing so by default and having the capability. So much for the certain cave dwelling AMD hater here that claims games don't use more then 2 or 4 threads.....

I guess PCper great articles by people that actually know what they are talking about prove the contrary.

Great job Ryan and Co. :)

July 16, 2014 | 05:08 PM - Posted by H1tman_Actua1


July 16, 2014 | 05:51 PM - Posted by Alamo

getting a minimum fps goes from 29 on DX to 58 in a game (like thief graphs) on Mantle is certainly worth the hype imo, that's terrificaly smooth gaming.

July 16, 2014 | 05:47 PM - Posted by Alamo

i wish Nvdia and Intel picks up the SDK once it's open, and integate their hardware on it, everyone stands to win from this, there is no downside from it, they are free to make the implementation they develope themselves, it's licence free, both intel and nvidia have R&D resources to spare for this, it wouldnt cost much, i get the political issue, but it's just that, question of pride.
most of the games that would be released on 2015/2016 would be Mantle if these 2 vendors pick it up.
in my opinion the wait for DX12 will be alot longer than expected, with all these news about windows 9 arn't good for DX12, microsoft pulling theplug on windows 7 support in january 2015, means DX12 will definitly not be on win7, probably not windows 8 since microsoft itself gave up on this OS, it's clear that DX12 will be exclusive to windows 9 following the tradition of microsoft, linking DX12 adoption to the migration speed of ppl to windows 9, and if things arn't bad enough, microsoft is planning a new DRM system for windows 9 forcing ppl to login for activation and linking the OS to the motherboard, rumors about subscrition plans for win9, all of this will just make the migration even slower to the new OS, how many years would it take for 40 or 50% of install base to move to windows 9, so that developing on directx 12 would be worth considering for developers, instead of being stuck on directx 11 for another 3 or 4 years...
i really hope AMD, Intel & Nvidia work something out about Mantle, so that everyone wins, instead of being all stuck with microsoft that takes PC gaming hostage in hope of selling their's bullshit
whynot make DX12 compatible win7 ??? if win9 is good ppl will get it, but why think they have to force ppl to get new OS, no one likes to be driven by a stick, i certainly dont!!
also hope valve doesn't screw SteamOS, personaly have alot of hopes on this OS, i am really tired of microsoft, i rather have Valve pushing a gaming OS forward, than having microsoft holding it back for the benefit of their gaming eco-system Xbox, and untill microsoft decides to make a clear distinction between PC market and console marker, like mobile and consoles, PC games will always be down graded and PC under utilized, in hopes for them to market the consoles as the peak of quality entertainement...
the frustrating probleme is, that me moving to windows 9 wouldn't even get me DX12 games, since i will be held by the migration of the rest on the install base, if they dont move fast enough, devs wouldn't use it, and i wouldn't have DX12 games untill they do, how many years should i wait ??

July 17, 2014 | 07:44 AM - Posted by renz (not verified)

maybe that can happen if AMD let Nvidia and Intel directly participate on deciding future Mantle spec and development or even better create an open body ala Khronos Group to maintain the API unlike what AMD is doing right now; being the only company that control the API. but as i heard it AMD intend to keep it that way for future version of Mantle. pride is one thing but if AMD really want to be the only company developing the API they will always have the advantage over other hardware vendor like intel/nvidia which is another good reason why intel/nvidia might not want to invest in mantle.

July 17, 2014 | 02:37 PM - Posted by Alamo

true, but have to be honest, developing Mantle and pushing it the way they did, it's still amazing from them to make it open SDK, and licence free to use, asking them to give away control it's really greedy and inadequate imo.
i get your point, although i dont find it very compelling, the developement of the API will be done by Nvidia or intel not AMD.
the issue would be when it would make it into the new Mantle Build, which is fair, there must be a way for them to work it out, and it's not like microsoft is a better alternative, their process is alot slower.

July 18, 2014 | 06:49 AM - Posted by renz (not verified)

then don't talk about "open" when in reality they don't really want to do that. the fact that intel has been asking from day one about Mantle spec was because AMD keep touting that the API will be Open. yet when asked for it they said they can't give it because it is still beta. fine it is beta so they can't disclose the details yet but while in beta period there are already four games (and more by the end of year) supporting mantle out in the market and running on AMD hardware. intel/nvidia can't get even start working on Mantle since they don't even have the spec and yet AMD hardware already capable using Mantle. also while they can't share the spec with hardware vendor they have no problem sharing Mantle spec with game developer RIGHT NOW who wants to implement Mantle in their future title.

July 18, 2014 | 07:17 AM - Posted by ROdNEY (not verified)

It is not about disclosing details, they do not have them! If you want to prepare driver for API you need documentation or you going to need to work twice a hard to at least bring anything. AMD wants fair conditions for all HW manufactures who will be making drivers. If they would give them incomplete details, then NVidia (and Intel) would be the first complaining and use it as an excuse to not make any driver. It is not only logical but also valid reason. However in v2.0 with new graphics / HSA optimizations, AMD will definitely have to talk to Intel and NVidia about implementation of those GPU specific features.

July 18, 2014 | 09:56 AM - Posted by renz (not verified)

if they don't have them then why there are already game capable of running games using the API? if AMD really wants fair condition for all they will bring in intel, nvidia and every other graphic vendor out there right now to refine the spec of Mantle 1.0 TOGETHER. not doing it all alone and be the only company that have the final decisions on what feature they want to include inside the API. they have no problem sharing 'beta' Mantle with game developer but why they can't do the same when company like Intel asking for details? they didn't want intel/nvidia to complain because of incomplete documentation but isn't it the same for game dev as well? but they give the access anyway and even make specific program to encourage dev to get an early look to Mantle.

July 18, 2014 | 01:38 PM - Posted by Alamo

that's why there is a beta test period, where AMD is asking feedback from devs, who are working on projects using Mantle, so features might be added, changed or removed during this beta, and thats why AMD let's in ppl who have a project using Mantle, Intel wasn't let into beta because they probably didnt have any projects, they were just curious and wanted a peak, thats why AMD told them in that case wait for the release it's few months down the road.
all of this is perfectly logical, beside complaining that Mantle doesnt have an Open SDK Yet is getting old, everyone know that it is coming out eventualy, why keep hamering the same point, when you know as well as everyone that it would be a completely irrelevant argument in couple months...
and also, it's really unfair, to see AMD after all this work and effort, and the benefit it brought to the API future, to see them willing to make it an open SDK for anyone to work on his own driver, licence free to implement, and yet come and say thats not enough you have to give it away to the community or im not playing... thats retarded, because the API will just die, with no one to push and finance it, get lost in direction and updates would take forever, like any other community open source software, and it's just down right Greedy asking it.

July 17, 2014 | 02:58 AM - Posted by JohnGR

What about a little Kabini?

Well with a Sempron 3850 overclocked at 1.625GHz, I got these results using Thief benchmark (very low quality, 1152x648 !!!).

DX 11 : Low 9.9 Avg. 13.2 Max 19.9
Mantle: Low 10.8 Avg. 14.2 Max 23.6

July 17, 2014 | 03:23 PM - Posted by P0ci (not verified)

Since when do you expect to play a next gen title on a 38 dollar APU, clocked less then 2 ghz?

July 17, 2014 | 05:04 PM - Posted by Alamo

maybe add a discerete gpu, igp on that 40$ cpu is a massive bottleneck before the cpu part, and you wont see Mantle gain if the gpu is the bottleneck.
still surprised though thats a solide 10% boost :D

July 18, 2014 | 07:08 AM - Posted by ROdNEY (not verified)

IGP is clearly the bottleneck there, regardless MANTLE even then give you a speed up.

July 18, 2014 | 04:33 PM - Posted by Nickolet (not verified)

DirectX 12 is going to be better from Mantle

July 19, 2014 | 02:26 AM - Posted by Martin Trautvetter

I wish a test purporting to assess a graphics API would use a more diverse set of CPUs.

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