Podcast #483 - News from CES: Kaby Lake G, Zen+, and more!

Subject: General Tech | January 18, 2018 - 12:05 PM |
Tagged: Zen+, Vega, spectre, podcast, meltdown, Kaby Lake G, Intel, amd

PC Perspective Podcast #483 - 01/18/18

Join us this week for a recap of news from CES 2018! We talk about Intel's Kaby Lake G processor featuring Vega graphics, Zen+ CPUs, the performance impact of Meltdown and more!

You can subscribe to us through iTunes and you can still access it directly through the RSS page HERE.

The URL for the podcast is: http://pcper.com/podcast - Share with your friends!

Hosts: Ryan Shrout, Jeremy Hellstrom, Josh Walrath, Allyn Malventano

Peanut Gallery: Ken Addison

Program length: 1:52:54

Podcast topics of discussion:

  1. Week in Review:
  2. 0:42:20 Thanks to HelloFresh for supporting our podcast. Go to HelloFresh.com and use the code pcper30 to get $30 off your first week of deliveries.
  3. News items of interest:
    1. CES 2018
      1. AMD
      2. ASUS
      3. Lenovo
  4. 1:40:20 Picks of the Week:
    1. Ryan: GPU Price suck.
  5. Closing/outro
 

CES 2018: AMD Ryzen Desktop CPU with Vega Graphics Coming Feb 12

Subject: Processors | January 8, 2018 - 12:00 AM |
Tagged: Zen, Vega, ryzen, CES 2018, CES, APU, amd, 2400G, 2200G

Though AMD might not use the term APU anymore, that’s what we are looking at today. The Ryzen + Vega processor (single die implementation, to be clear) for desktop solutions will begin shipping February 12 and will bring high-performance integrated graphics to low cost PCs. Fully titled the “AMD Ryzen Desktop Processor with Radeon Vega Graphics”, this new processor will utilize the same AM4 socket and motherboards that have been shipping since March of 2017. Finally, a good use for those display outputs!

04.jpg

Though enthusiasts might have little interest in these parts, it is an important step for AMD. Building a low-cost PC with a Ryzen CPU has been difficult due to the requirement of a discrete graphics card. Nearly all of Intel’s processors have integrated graphics, and though we might complain about the performance it provides in games, the truth is that the value of not needing another component is crucial for reducing costs.

03.jpg

Without an APU that had both graphics and the company’s greatly improved Zen CPU architecture, AMD was leaving a lot of potential sales on the table. Also, the market for entry-level gaming in small form factor designs is significant.

02.jpg

Two models will be launching: the Ryzen 5 2400G and Ryzen 3 2200G. Clock speeds are higher than what exists on the Ryzen 5 1400 and Ryzen 3 1200 and match the core and thread count. The 2400G includes 11 Compute Units (704 stream processors) and the 2200G has 8 CUs (512 stream processors). The TDP of both is 65 watts.

01.jpg

The pricing configuration gives AMD some impressive placement. The $169 Ryzen 5 2400G will offer much better graphics performance than the $30 more expensive Core i5-8400 (based on current pricing) and has equivalent performance to the $100+ higher Core i5-8400 and NVIDIA GT 1030 discrete solution.

05.jpg

When looking at CPU performance, the new Ryzen processors offer higher scores than the units they are replacing. They do this while adding Vega graphics capability and matching or lower prices.

08.jpg

AMD even went as far to show the overclocking headroom that the Ryzen APU can offer. During an on-site demo we saw the Ryzen 5 2400G improve its 3DMark score by 39% with memory frequency and GPU clock speed increases. Moving the GPU clock from ~1100 MHz to 1675 MHz will mean a significant increase in power consumption, and I do question the size of the audience that wants to overclock an APU. Still – cool to see!

The Ryzen CPU with Vega graphics is a product we all expected to see, it’s the first perfect marriage of AMD’s revitalized CPU division and its considerable advantage in integrated graphics. It has been a long time since one of AMD’s APUs appeared interesting to me and stoked my desire to build a low-cost, mainstream gaming build. Looks for reviews in just a few short weeks!

Source: PCPer

CES 2018: AMD teases 7nm Vega for machine learning in 2018

Subject: Graphics Cards | January 8, 2018 - 12:00 AM |
Tagged: Vega, CES 2018, CES, amd, 7nm

Though just the most basic of teases, AMD confirmed at CES that it will have a 7nm based Vega product sampling sometime in 2018. No mention of shipping timeline, performance, or consumer variants were to be found.

01_0.jpg

This product will target the machine learning market, with hardware and platform optimizations key to that segment. AMD mentions “new DL Ops”, or deep learning operations, but the company didn’t expand on that. It could mean it will integrate Tensor Core style compute units (as NVIDIA did on the Volta architecture) or it may be something more unique. AMD will integrate a new IO, likely to compete with NVLink, and MxGPU support for dividing resources efficiently for virtualization.

02_0.jpg

AMD did present a GPU “roadmap” at the tech day as well. I put that word in quotes because it is incredibly, and intentionally, vague. You might assume that Navi is being placed into the 2019 window, but its possible it might show in late 2018. AMD was also unable to confirm if a 7nm Vega variant would arrive for gaming and consumer markets in 2018.

Source: PCPer
Author:
Subject: Processors
Manufacturer: Intel

The end of the world as we know it?

A surprise to most in the industry that such a thing would really occur, AMD and Intel announced in November a partnership that would bring Radeon graphics to Intel processors in 2018. The details were minimal at the time, and only told us specifics of the business relationship: this was a product purchase and not a license, no IP was changing hands, this was considered a semi-custom design for the AMD group, Intel was handling all the integration and packaging. Though we knew that the product would use HBM2 memory, the same utilized on the RX Vega products released last year, it was possible that the “custom” part was a Polaris architecture that had been retrofitted. Also, details of the processor side of this technology was left a mystery.

Today we have our answers and our first hands-on with systems utilizing what was previously known as Kaby Lake-G and what is now officially titled the “8th Generation Intel Core Processors with Radeon RX Vega M Graphics.” I’m serious.

8th Gen Intel Core processor.jpg

For what I still call Kaby Lake-G, as it easier to type and understand, it introduces a new product line that we have not seen addressed in a very long time – high performance processors with high performance integrated graphics. Even though the combined part is not a single piece of silicon but instead a multi-chip package, it serves the same purpose in the eyes of the consumer and the OEM. The marriage of Intel’s highest performance mobile processor cores, the 8th Generation H-series, and one of, if not THE fastest mobile graphics core in a reasonable thermal envelope, the Vega M, is incredibly intriguing for all kinds of reasons. Even the currently announced AMD APUs and those in the public roadmaps don’t offer a combined performance package as impressive as this. Ryzen Mobile is interesting in its own right, but Kaby Lake-G is on a different level.

From a business standpoint, KBL-G is a design meant to attack NVIDIA. The green giant has become one of the most important computing companies on the planet in the last couple of years, leaning into its graphics processor dominance and turning it into cash and mindshare in the world of machine learning and AI. More than any other company, Intel is worried about the growth and capability of NVIDIA. Though not as sexy as “machine learning”, NVIDIA has dominated the mobile graphics markets as well, offering discrete GPU solutions to pair with Intel processor notebooks. In turn, NVIDIA eats up much of the margin and profitability that these mainstream gaming and content creation machines can generate. Productization of things like Max-Q give the market reason to believe that NVIDIA is the true innovator in the space, regardless of the legitimate answer to that question. Intel see that as no bueno – it wants to remain the leader in the market completely.

kblg-4.jpg

Continue reading our overview of the new Intel 8th Gen Processors with Vega M graphics!

Podcast #482 - Spectre, Meltdown, Cord Cutting, and more!

Subject: General Tech | January 4, 2018 - 11:28 AM |
Tagged: Z370, Vega, spectre, msi, meltdown, Koolance, Kaby Lake G, google wifi, cord cutting, apple, Android, 400A-S, podcast

PC Perspective Podcast #482 - 1/04/18

Join us for discussion on Spectre, Meltdown, Cord Cutting, and more!

You can subscribe to us through iTunes and you can still access it directly through the RSS page HERE.

The URL for the podcast is: http://pcper.com/podcast - Share with your friends!

Hosts: Ryan Shrout, Jermey Hellstrom, Josh Walrath, Allyn Malventano

Peanut Gallery: Ken Addison, Alex Lustenberg

Program length: 1:01:54

Podcast topics of discussion:
  1. Week in Review:
  2. News items of interest:
  3. Picks of the Week:
  4. Closing/outro

Source:

Rumour mill; Vega makes an appearance on Kaby Lake G?

Subject: General Tech | January 2, 2018 - 12:28 PM |
Tagged: Vega, kaby lake-g, Intel, amd

If the leaked chip specifications over at The Inquirer are accurate, we will be seeing AMD Vega GPUs moving into Intel's chip package.  The tortuously named i7-8809G will have a TDP of 100W, a base clock of 3.1GHz and a Radeon RX Vega M GH graphics accelerator in addition to Intel's own HD 630.  The chip has since disappeared from online listings but hints at what could be a very interesting reveal at CES this year; we will know more in just a few short days.  NVIDIA has not yet made any comments about this reveal, which could have a significant impact on their lower end sales.

slack-imgs.com_.jpg

"Listed as an Intel Core i7-8809G, the quad-core eight-thread processor comes sporting both integrated Intel HD 630 graphics and packaged graphics acceleration in the form of the Radeon RX Vega M GH."

Here is some more Tech News from around the web:

Tech Talk

 

Source: The Inquirer
Author:
Manufacturer: NVIDIA

Looking Towards the Professionals

This is a multi-part story for the NVIDIA Titan V:

Earlier this week we dove into the new NVIDIA Titan V graphics card and looked at its performacne from a gaming perspective. Our conclusions were more or less what we expected - the card was on average ~20% faster than the Titan Xp and about ~80% faster than the GeForce GTX 1080. But with that $3000 price tag, the Titan V isn't going to win any enthusiasts over.

What the Titan V is meant for in reality is the compute space. Developers, coders, engineers, and professionals that use GPU hardware for research, for profit, or for both. In that case, $2999 for the Titan V is simply an investment that needs to show value in select workloads. And though $3000 is still a lot of money, keep in mind that the NVIDIA Quadro GP100, the most recent part with full-performance double precision compute from the Pascal chip, is still selling for well over $6000 today. 

IMG_5009.JPG

The Volta GV100 GPU offers 1:2 double precision performance, equating to 2560 FP64 cores. That is a HUGE leap over the GP102 GPU used on the Titan Xp that uses a 1:32 ratio, giving us just 120 FP64 cores equivalent.

  Titan V Titan Xp GTX 1080 Ti GTX 1080 GTX 1070 Ti GTX 1070 RX Vega 64 Liquid Vega Frontier Edition
GPU Cores 5120 3840 3584 2560 2432 1920 4096 4096
FP64 Cores 2560 120 112 80 76 60 256 256
Base Clock 1200 MHz 1480 MHz 1480 MHz 1607 MHz 1607 MHz 1506 MHz 1406 MHz 1382 MHz
Boost Clock 1455 MHz 1582 MHz 1582 MHz 1733 MHz 1683 MHz 1683 MHz 1677 MHz 1600 MHz
Texture Units 320 240 224 160 152 120 256 256
ROP Units 96 96 88 64 64 64 64 64
Memory 12GB 12GB 11GB 8GB 8GB 8GB 8GB 16GB
Memory Clock 1700 MHz MHz 11400 MHz 11000 MHz 10000 MHz 8000 MHz 8000 MHz 1890 MHz 1890 MHz
Memory Interface 3072-bit
HBM2
384-bit G5X 352-bit G5X 256-bit G5X 256-bit 256-bit 2048-bit HBM2 2048-bit HBM2
Memory Bandwidth 653 GB/s 547 GB/s 484 GB/s 320 GB/s 256 GB/s 256 GB/s 484 GB/s 484 GB/s
TDP 250 watts 250 watts 250 watts 180 watts 180 watts 150 watts 345 watts 300 watts
Peak Compute 12.2 (base) TFLOPS
14.9 (boost) TFLOPS
12.1 TFLOPS 11.3 TFLOPS 8.2 TFLOPS 7.8 TFLOPS 5.7 TFLOPS 13.7 TFLOPS 13.1 TFLOPS
Peak DP Compute 6.1 (base) TFLOPS
7.45 (boost) TFLOPS
0.37 TFLOPS 0.35 TFLOPS 0.25 TFLOPS 0.24 TFLOPS 0.17 TFLOPS 0.85 TFLOPS 0.81 TFLOPS
MSRP (current) $2999 $1299 $699 $499 $449 $399 $699 $999

The current AMD Radeon RX Vega 64, and the Vega Frontier Edition, all ship with a 1:16 FP64 ratio, giving us the equivalent of 256 DP cores per card.

Test Setup and Benchmarks

Our testing setup remains the same from our gaming tests, but obviously the software stack is quite different. 

  PC Perspective GPU Testbed
Processor Intel Core i7-5960X Haswell-E
Motherboard ASUS Rampage V Extreme X99
Memory G.Skill Ripjaws 16GB DDR4-3200
Storage OCZ Agility 4 256GB (OS)
Adata SP610 500GB (games)
Power Supply Corsair AX1500i 1500 watt
OS Windows 10 x64
Drivers AMD: 17.10.2
NVIDIA: 388.59

Applications in use include:

  • Luxmark 
  • Cinebench R15
  • VRay
  • Sisoft Sandra GPU Compute
  • SPECviewperf 12.1
  • FAHBench

Let's not drag this along - I know you are hungry for results! (Thanks to Ken for running most of these tests for us!!)

Continue reading part 2 of our Titan V review on compute performance!!

SAPPHIRE Releases NITRO+ Radeon RX Vega (64 & 56)

Subject: Graphics Cards | December 15, 2017 - 09:00 AM |
Tagged: vega 64 liquid, vega 64, vega 56, Vega, sapphire, radeon, amd

SAPPHIRE has just launched a pair of custom cooled, factory overclocked, RX Vega-based graphics cards. As you might guess: the SAPPHIRE NITRO+ Radeon RX Vega 64 uses the Vega 64 chip with its 4096 stream processors, while the SAPPHIRE NITRO+ Radeon RX Vega 56 uses the Vega 56 chip and its 3584 stream processors. Both cards have 8GB of HBM2 memory (two stacks of 4GB). The cooler design uses three fans and vapor chambers, with separate heat pipes for the GPU+Memory (six pipes) and VRMs (two pipes).

11275-00_VEGA64_Nitro_Plus_2DP2HDMI_C03.jpg

It also has a back plate!

11275-00_VEGA64_Nitro_Plus_2DP2HDMI_C05.jpg

The clock rate is where it gets interesting. The NITRO+ RX Vega 64 will have a boost clock of 1611 MHz out-of-the-box. This is above the RX Vega 64 Air’s boost clock (1546 MHz) but below the RX Vega 64 Liquid’s boost clock (1677 MHz). The liquid-cooled Radeon RX Vega 64 still has the highest clocks, but this product sits almost exactly half-way between it (the liquid-cooled RX Vega 64) and the air-cooled RX Vega 64.

The NITRO+ Radeon RX Vega 56, with its 1572 MHz boost clock, is well above the stock RX Vega 56’s 1471 MHz boost clock, though. It’s a clear win.

fancontrol.png

As for enthusiast features, this card has quite a few ways to keep it cool. First, it will operate fanless until 56C. Second, the card accepts a 4-pin fan connector, which allows it to adjust the speed of two case fans based on the temperature readings from the card. I am a bit curious whether it’s better to let the GPU control the fans, or whether having them all attached to the same place allows them to work together more effectively. Either way, if you ran out of fan headers, then I’m guessing that this feature will be good for you anyway.

The SAPPHIRE NITRO+ Radeon RX Vega 64 and 56 are available now.

Source: SAPPHIRE

Podcast #478 - Windows on ARM, Intel 10nm rumors, and more!

Subject: General Tech | December 7, 2017 - 01:45 PM |
Tagged: podcast, xfx, Vega, Raspberry Pi, radeon, qualcomm, nicehash, Intel, IME, GTX 1070Ti, gddr6, evga, Elgato, dell, coolermaster, cluster, asus, arm, amd, AM4, Adrenalin Edition, 4k60, 10nm, video

PC Perspective Podcast #478 - 12/07/17

Join us for discussion on Windows on ARM, Intel 10nm rumors, and more!

You can subscribe to us through iTunes and you can still access it directly through the RSS page HERE.

The URL for the podcast is: http://pcper.com/podcast - Share with your friends!

Hosts: Ryan Shrout, Josh Walrath, Jeremy Hellstrom, Allyn Malventano, Jim Tanous

Peanut Gallery: Alex Lustenberg

Program length: 1:39:42

Podcast topics of discussion:
  1. Week in Review:
  2. News items of interest:
  3. Closing/outro

Source:

AMD Is Very Pleased To Participate in Blockchain Technology

Subject: General Tech, Graphics Cards | December 3, 2017 - 04:26 PM |
Tagged: bitcoin, cryptocurrency, mining, gaming, lisa su, amd, Vega

AMD’s CEO Lisa Su was recently appeared on CNBC’s Power Lunch Exclusinve interview segment where she answered questions about bitcoin, blockchain technology, the tax reform bill, and sexual harassment in the workplace.

AMD CNBC.png

Of particular interest to PC Perspective readers, Dr. Lisa Su shared several interesting bits of information on cryptocurrency mining and how it is affecting the company’s graphics cards. Surprisingly, she stated that cryptocurrency miners were a "very small percentage" of sales and specifically that they represented a mid-single digit percentage of buyers (~4 to 6 percent). This number is hard to believe for me as I expected it to be significantly higher with the prices of graphics cards continuing to climb well above MSRP (it wasn’t too bad when writing our gift guide and shortly after but just as I was about to commit I looked and prices had shot back up again coinciding with a resurgence in mining popularity with the price of cryptocurrencies rising and improving ROI).

Further, the AMD president and CEO states that the company is interested in this market, but they are mainly waiting to see how businesses and industries adopt blockchain technologies. AMD is “very pleased to participate in blockchain” and believes it is a “very important foundational product”. Dr. Lisa Su did not seem very big on bitcoin specifically, but did seem interested in the underlying blockchain technologies and future cryptocurrencies.

Beyond bitcoin, altcoins, and the GPU mining craze, AMD believes that gaming is and continues to be a tremendous growth market for the company. AMD has reportedly launched 10 new product families and saw sizeable increases in sales on Amazon and Newegg versus last year with processor sales tripling and double digital percentage increases in graphics sales in 2017. AMD also managed to be in two of the three gaming towers in Best Buy for the holiday buying season.

Speaking for AMD Dr. Su also had a few other interesting bits of information to share. The interview is fairly short and worth watching. Thankfully Kyle over at HardOCP managed to record it and you can watch it here. If you aren't able to stream the video, PCGamer has transcribed most of the major statements.

What are your thoughts on the interview? Will we ever see GPU prices return to normal so I can upgrade, and do you agree with AMD’s assessment that miners are such a small percentage of their sales and not as much of an influencer in pricing as we thought (perhaps it’s a supply problem rather than a demand problem, or the comment was only taking their mining-specific cards into account?)?

Source: HardOCP