Subject: Editorial | August 18, 2016 - 02:20 PM | Ryan Shrout
Tagged: video, podcast, pascal, nvidia, msi, mobile, Intel, idf, GTX 1080, gtx 1070, gtx 1060, gigabyte, FMS, Flash Memory Summit, asus, arm, 10nm
PC Perspective Podcast #413 - 08/18/2016
Join us this week as we discuss the new mobile GeForce GTX 10-series gaming notebooks, ARM and Intel partnering on 10nm, Flash Memory Summit and more!
The URL for the podcast is: http://pcper.com/podcast - Share with your friends!
- iTunes - Subscribe to the podcast directly through the Store (audio only)
- Google Play - Subscribe to our audio podcast directly through Google Play!
- RSS - Subscribe through your regular RSS reader (audio only)
- MP3 - Direct download link to the MP3 file
Hosts: Allyn Malventano, Sebastian Peak, Josh Walrath and Jeremy Hellstrom
Week in Review:
This episode of PC Perspective is brought to you by Casper!! Use code “PCPER”
News items of interest:
0:42:05 Final news from FMS 2016
Hardware/Software Picks of the Week
Subject: Systems | August 16, 2016 - 08:00 AM | Sebastian Peak
Tagged: PC, nvidia, Lenovo, Intel Core i7, IdeaCentre Y910, GTX 1080, gaming, desktop, all in one, AIO
Lenovo has announced a new all-in-one gaming desktop, and the IdeaCentre Y910 offers up to a
7th-generation 6th-generation Intel Core i7 processor and NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1080 graphics behind its 27-inch QHD display.
But this is no ordinary all-in-one, as Lenovo has designed the Y910 to be "effortlessly upgradeable":
"Designed to game, engineered to evolve, the IdeaCentreTM AIO Y910 is easy to upgrade –
no special tools needed. Simply press the Y button to pop out the back panel, for effortless swapping of your GPU, Memory or Storage."
The specs include a 7th-gen Intel Core i7 processor, and if that's not a typo we're talking about Intel Kaby Lake here. Specs have been corrected as 6th-gen Intel Core processors up to an i7. Exactly what SKU might be inside the Y910 isn't clear just yet, and we'll update when we know for sure. It would be limited to 65 W based on the specified cooling, and notice that the CPU isn't on the list of user-upgradable parts (though it could still be possible).
Here's a rundown of specs from Lenovo:
- Processor: Up to a 6th-generation Intel Core i7 Processor
- Graphics: Up to NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1080 8 GB
- Memory: Up to 32 GB DDR4
- Storage: Up to 2 TB HDD + 256 GB SSD
- Display: 27-inch QHD (2560x1440) near-edgeless
- Audio: Integrated 7.1 Channel Dolby Audio, 5W Harmon Kardon speakers
- Webcam: 720p, Single Array Microphone
- Networking: Killer DoubleShot WiFi / LAN
- Rear Ports:
- 2x USB 2.0
- HDMI-in / HDMI-out
- Side Ports:
- 3x USB 3.0
- 6-in-1 Card Reader (SD, SDHC, SDXC, MMC, MS, MS-Pro) Headphone, Microphone
- Cooling: 65 W
- Dimensions (W x L x H): 237.6 x 615.8 x 490.25 mm (9.35 x 24.24 x 19.3 inches)
- Weight: Starting at 27 lbs (12.24 kg)
Update: The IdeaCentre Y910 starts at $1,799.99 for a version with the GTX 1070, and will be available in October.
Subject: Systems | August 16, 2016 - 08:00 AM | Sebastian Peak
Tagged: small form-factor, SFF, nvidia, Lenovo, Killer Networking, Intel, IdeaCentre Y710 Cube, GTX 1080, gaming, gamescom, cube
Lenovo has announced the IdeaCentre Y710 Cube; a small form-factor system designed for gaming regardless of available space, and it can be configured with some very high-end desktop components for serious performance.
"Ideal for gamers who want to stay competitive no matter where they play, the IdeaCentre Y710 Cube comes with a built-in carry handle for easy transport between gaming stations. Housed sleekly within a new, compact cube form factor, it features NVIDIA’s latest GeForce GTX graphics and 6th Gen Intel Core processors to handle today’s most resource-intensive releases."
The Y710 Cube offers NVIDIA GeForce graphics up to the GTX 1080, and up to a 6th-generation Core i7 processor. (Though a specific processor number was not mentioned, this is likely the non-K Core i7-6700 CPU given the 65W cooler specified below).
Lenovo offers a pre-installed XBox One controller receiver with the Y710 Cube to position the small desktop as a console alternative, and the machines are configured with SSD storage and feature Killer Double Shot Pro networking (where the NIC and wireless card are combined for better performance).
- Processor: Up to 6th Generation Intel Core i7 Processor
- Operating System: Windows 10 Home
- Graphics: Up to NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1080; 8 GB
- Memory: Up to 32 GB DDR4
- Storage: Up to 2 TB HDD + 256 GB SSD
- Cooling: 65 W
- Networking: Killer LAN / WiFi 10/100/1000M
- Video: 1x HDMI, 1x VGA
- Rear Ports: 1x USB 2.0 1x USB 3.0
- Front Ports: 2x USB 3.0
- Dimensions (L x D x H): 393.3 x 252.3 x 314.5 mm (15.48 x 9.93 x 12.38 inches)
- Weight: Starting at 16.3 lbs (7.4 kg)
- Carry Handle: Yes
- Accessory: Xbox One Wireless Controller/Receiver (optional)
The IdeaCentre Y710 Cube is part of Lenovo's Gamescom 2016 annoucement, and will be available for purchase starting in October. Pricing starts at $1,299.99 for a version with the GTX 1070.
Take your Pascal on the go
Easily the strongest growth segment in PC hardware today is in the adoption of gaming notebooks. Ask companies like MSI and ASUS, even Gigabyte, as they now make more models and sell more units of notebooks with a dedicated GPU than ever before. Both AMD and NVIDIA agree on this point and it’s something that AMD was adamant in discussing during the launch of the Polaris architecture.
Both AMD and NVIDIA predict massive annual growth in this market – somewhere on the order of 25-30%. For an overall culture that continues to believe the PC is dying, seeing projected growth this strong in any segment is not only amazing, but welcome to those of us that depend on it. AMD and NVIDIA have different goals here: GeForce products already have 90-95% market share in discrete gaming notebooks. In order for NVIDIA to see growth in sales, the total market needs to grow. For AMD, simply taking back a portion of those users and design wins would help its bottom line.
But despite AMD’s early talk about getting Polaris 10 and 11 in mobile platforms, it’s NVIDIA again striking first. Gaming notebooks with Pascal GPUs in them will be available today, from nearly every system vendor you would consider buying from: ASUS, MSI, Gigabyte, Alienware, Razer, etc. NVIDIA claims to have quicker adoption of this product family in notebooks than in any previous generation. That’s great news for NVIDIA, but might leave AMD looking in from the outside yet again.
Technologically speaking though, this makes sense. Despite the improvement that Polaris made on the GCN architecture, Pascal is still more powerful and more power efficient than anything AMD has been able to product. Looking solely at performance per watt, which is really the defining trait of mobile designs, Pascal is as dominant over Polaris as Maxwell was to Fiji. And this time around NVIDIA isn’t messing with cut back parts that have brand changes – GeForce is diving directly into gaming notebooks in a way we have only seen with one release.
The ASUS G752VS OC Edition with GTX 1070
Do you remember our initial look at the mobile variant of the GeForce GTX 980? Not the GTX 980M mind you, the full GM204 operating in notebooks. That was basically a dry run for what we see today: NVIDIA will be releasing the GeForce GTX 1080, GTX 1070 and GTX 1060 to notebooks.
Subject: Systems, Mobile | August 16, 2016 - 12:00 AM | Sebastian Peak
Tagged: pascal, nvidia, notebook, msi, GTX 1080, gtx 1070, gtx 1060, gaming laptop, gaming
MSI has updated their gaming notebook lineup with the new NVIDIA Pascal mobile GPUs, with the GTX 1080, GTX 1070, and GTX 1060 now available across the board. MSI says the new GPUs will provide up to 40% better performance than the company’s previous GT, GS, and GE models.
“MSI’s GT83/73VR Titan series now showcases an even more commanding design with sports car inspired exhausts and MSI’s Cooler Boost Titan, featuring multiple exhausts and dual whirlwind blade fans to guarantee the best performance even under the most stress. Available in 3 different sizes and 17 unique configurations, including with SLI graphics, 4K panels and Tobii’s eye-tracking technology, MSI’s GT series is the optimum laptop for serious gamers.”
Positioned at the top of the heap is the mighty Titan series, which naturally offers the highest possible specs for those who can afford the price tag.
Notice anything about the top-end GT83 model in the chart above? The GT83VR Titan SLI indeed contains not one, but two NVIDIA GTX 1080 graphics chips, making this $5099 gaming machine a monster of a system - though its 1080p screen real estate means a connected VR headset will be more likely to use all of that available GPU power.
Moving down to the GT72/GT62 series, we see a move to the GTX 1070 GPU accross the board:
Next up is the GS73, which offers (in addition to Pascal graphics) MSI's "Cooler Boost Trinity", which is the company's advanced cooling system for thin notebook designs.
“MSI’s redesigned GS73/63 VR Stealth Pro series now comes with MSI’s Cooler Boost Trinity, a temperature control system featuring three ultra-thin whirlwind blade fans, and a 5-pipe thermal design optimized for ultra-slim gaming notebooks. Available in 17-inch, 15-inch, and 14-inch options, MSI’s GS series gives power mobile gaming a new meaning with the performance of larger systems while measuring less than 1-inch thick.”
The more modest GTX 1060 powers the <1 inch thick notebooks in the series, and both the GS73 and GS63 VR Stealth Pro are equipped with 4K resolution IPS screens (with the GS43VR Phantom Pro at 1080p).
Next we have the VR Apache series, with another approach to cooling called "Cooler Boost 4":
“MSI’s GE72/62 VR Apache series now features MSI’s Cooler Boost 4 technology, an enhanced cooling system with multiple exhausts to keep temperatures low even during the most headed battles. Starting at $1,649, the VR-ready GE series comes in two different sizes and is the ideal unit for gaming enthusiast looking for a powerful and reliable unit.”
These lower-cost gaming machines are still equipped with Intel Core i7 processors, and offer GTX 1060 graphics for both models.
As a very interesting addition to the news of these new laptops, MSI has also announced that select machines equipped with NVIDIA GTX 10 Series graphics will feature 120Hz IPS panels with a 5ms response time.
We should have more imformation on availability soon.
Subject: Graphics Cards | August 12, 2016 - 10:59 AM | Sebastian Peak
Tagged: overclock, nvidia, msi, liquid cooled, hydro H55, hydro gfx, GTX 1080, graphics card, gaming, corsair
Corsair and MSI have teamed up once again to produce a liquid-cooled edition of the latest NVIDIA GPU, with the GTX 1080 receiving the same treatment these two gave to the Hydro GFX version of GTX 980 Ti last year.
“The CORSAIR Hydro GFX GTX 1080 brings all the benefits of liquid cooling to the GeForce GTX 1080, boasting an integrated CORSAIR Hydro Series H55 cooler that draws heat from the GPU via a micro-fin copper base cold plate and dissipates it efficiently using a 120mm high-surface area radiator. A pre-installed low-noise LED-lit 120mm fan ensures steady, reliable air-flow, keeping GPU temperatures down and clock speeds high.
With a low-profile PCB and pre-fitted, fully-sealed liquid cooler, the Hydro GFX GTX 1080 is simple and easy to install. Just fit the card into a PCI-E 3.0 x16 slot, mount the radiator and enjoy low maintenance liquid cooling for the lifetime of the card.”
Naturally, with an integrated closed-loop liquid cooler this GTX 1080 won't be relegated to stock speeds out of the box, though Corsair leaves this up to the user. The card offers three performance modes which allow users to choose between lower noise and higher performance. Silent Mode leaves the GTX 1080 at stock settings (1733 MHz Boost), Gaming Mode increases the Boost clock to 1822 MHz, and OC Mode increases this slightly to 1847 MHz (while increasing memory speed in this mode as well).
This liquid-cooled version will provide higher sustained clocks
Here are the full specs from Corsair:
- GPU: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1080
- CUDA Cores: 2,560
- Interface: PCI Express 3.0 x16
- Boost / Base Core Clock:
- 1,847 MHz / 1,708 MHz (OC Mode)
- 1,822 MHz / 1,683 MHz (Gaming Mode)
- 1,733 MHz / 1,607 MHz (Silent Mode)
- Memory Clock:
- 10,108 MHz (OC Mode)
- 10,010 MHZ (Gaming Mode)
- 10,010 MHz (Silent Mode)
- Memory Size: 8192MB
- Memory Type: 8GB GDDR5X
- Memory Bus: 256-bit
- 3x DisplayPort (Version 1.4)
- 1x HDMI (Version 2.0)
- 1x DL-DVI-D
- Power Connector: 8-pin x 1
- Power Consumption: 180W
- Dimension / Weight:Card: 270 x 111 x 40 mm / 1249 g
- Cooler: 151 x 118 x 52 mm/ 1286 g
- SKU: CB-9060010-WW
The Corsair Hydro GFX GTX 1080 is available now, exclusively on Corsair's official online store, and priced at $749.99.
Realworldtech with Compelling Evidence
Yesterday David Kanter of Realworldtech posted a pretty fascinating article and video that explored the two latest NVIDIA architectures and how they have branched away from the traditional immediate mode rasterization units. It has revealed through testing that with Maxwell and Pascal NVIDIA has gone to a tiling method with rasterization. This is a somewhat significant departure for the company considering they have utilized the same basic immediate mode rasterization model since the 90s.
The Videologic Apocolypse 3Dx based on the PowerVR PCX2.
(photo courtesy of Wikipedia)
Tiling is an interesting subject and we can harken back to the PowerVR days to see where it was first implemented. There are many advantages to tiling and deferred rendering when it comes to overall efficiency in power and memory bandwidth. These first TBDR (Tile Based Deferred Renderers) offered great performance per clock and could utilize slower memory as compared to other offerings of the day (namely Voodoo Graphics). There were some significant drawbacks to the technology. Essentially a lot of work had to be done by the CPU and driver in scene setup and geometry sorting. On fast CPU systems the PowerVR boards could provide very good performance, but it suffered on lower end parts as compared to the competition. This is a very simple explanation of what is going on, but the long and short of it is that TBDR did not take over the world due to limitations in its initial implementations. Traditional immediate mode rasters would improve in efficiency and performance with aggressive Z checks and other optimizations that borrow from the TBDR playbook.
Tiling is also present in a lot of mobile parts. Imagination’s PowerVR graphics technologies have been implemented by others such as Intel, Apple, Mediatek, and others. Qualcomm (Adreno) and ARM (Mali) both implement tiler technologies to improve power consumption and performance while increasing bandwidth efficiency. Perhaps most interestingly we can remember back to the Gigapixel days with the GP-1 chip that implemented a tiling method that seemed to work very well without the CPU hit and driver overhead that had plagued the PowerVR chips up to that point. 3dfx bought Gigapixel for some $150 million at the time. That company then went on to file bankruptcy a year later and their IP was acquired by NVIDIA.
Screenshot of the program used to uncover the tiling behavior of the rasterizer.
It now appears as though NVIDIA has evolved their raster units to embrace tiling. This is not a full TBDR implementation, but rather an immediate mode tiler that will still break up the scene in tiles but does not implement deferred rendering. This change should improve bandwidth efficiency when it comes to rasterization, but it does not affect the rest of the graphics pipeline by forcing it to be deferred (tessellation, geometry setup and shaders, etc. are not impacted). NVIDIA has not done a deep dive on this change for editors, so we do not know the exact implementation and what advantages we can expect. We can look at the evidence we have and speculate where those advantages exist.
The video where David Kanter explains his findings
Bandwidth and Power
Tilers have typically taken the tiled regions and buffered them on the chip. This is a big improvement in both performance and power efficiency as the raster data does not have to be cached and written out to the frame buffer and then swapped back. This makes quite a bit of sense considering the overall lack of big jumps in memory technologies over the past five years. We have had GDDR-5 since 2007/2008. The speeds have increased over time, but the basic technology is still much the same. We have seen HBM introduced with AMD’s Fury series, but large scale production of HBM 2 is still to come. Samsung has released small amounts of HBM 2 to the market, but not nearly enough to handle the needs of a mass produced card. GDDR-5X is an extension of GDDR-5 that does offer more bandwidth, but it is still not a next generation memory technology like HBM 2.
By utilizing a tiler NVIDIA is able to lower memory bandwidth needs for the rasterization stage. Considering that both Maxwell and Pascal architectures are based on GDDR-5 and 5x technologies, it makes sense to save as much bandwidth as possible where they can. This is again probably one, among many, of the reasons that we saw a much larger L2 cache in Maxwell vs. Kepler (2048 KB vs. 256KB respectively). Every little bit helps when we are looking at hard, real world bandwidth limits for a modern GPU.
The area of power efficiency has also come up in discussion when going to a tiler. Tilers have traditionally been more power efficient as well due to how the raster data is tiled and cached, requiring fewer reads and writes to main memory. The first impulse is to say, “Hey, this is the reason why NVIDIA’s Maxwell was so much more power efficient than Kepler and AMD’s latest parts!” Sadly, this is not exactly true. The tiler is more power efficient, but it is a small part to the power savings on a GPU.
The second fastest Pascal based card...
A modern GPU is very complex. There are some 7.2 billion transistors on the latest Pascal GP-104 that powers the GTX 1080. The vast majority of those transistors are implemented in the shader units of the chip. While the raster units are very important, they are but a fraction of that transistor budget. The rest is taken up by power regulation, PCI-E controllers, and memory controllers. In the big scheme of things the raster portion is going to be dwarfed in power consumption by the shader units. This does not mean that they are not important though. Going back to the hated car analogy, one does not achieve weight savings by focusing on one aspect alone. It is going over every single part of the car and shaving ounces here and there, and in the end achieving significant savings by addressing every single piece of a complex product.
This does appear to be the long and short of it. This is one piece of a very complex ASIC that improves upon memory bandwidth utilization and power efficiency. It is not the whole story, but it is an important part. I find it interesting that NVIDIA did not disclose this change to editors with the introduction of Maxwell and Pascal, but if it is transparent to users and developers alike then there is no need. There is a lot of “secret sauce” that goes into each architecture, and this is merely one aspect. The one question that I do have is how much of the technology is based upon the Gigapixel IP that 3dfx bought at such a premium? I believe that particular tiler was an immediate mode renderer as well due to it not having as many driver and overhead issues that PowerVR exhibited back in the day. Obviously it would not be a copy/paste of the technology that was developed back in the 90s, it would be interesting to see if it was the basis for this current implementation.
Subject: Graphics Cards | July 11, 2016 - 01:59 PM | Jeremy Hellstrom
Tagged: GTX 1080, GameRock Premium, palit, factory overclocked
Palit's card is certainly unique looking in the GTX 1080 market, that blue, white and silver is not a colour palette used by other manufacturers. That is not the only difference between this card and a stock GTX 1080, it is also overclocked with a core of 1746 MHz and VRAM at 1315 MHz, along with a cooler that covers the entire card and takes up three slots. That extra cooling ability translates into a card that runs at 30dBA under load, and TechPowerUp did not see temperatures exceeding 72°C. It is a little on the expensive side but if you have space in your case this is a worth contender for your hard earned cash.
"Palit's GTX 1080 GameRock uses a mighty triple-slot dual-fan design, which provides excellent temperatures and noise levels better than any GTX 1080 we tested so far. The fans also turn off in idle, and thanks to the large overclock out the box, the card is the fastest GTX 1080 we ever tested, too."
Here are some more Graphics Card articles from around the web:
- EVGA GeForce GTX 1070 SuperClocked 8 GB @ techPowerUp
- ASUS STRIX GAMING GTX 1080 @ eTeknix
- ASUS GTX 950-2G “Unplugged” @ Kitguru
- PNY GTX 950 2GB and GTX 960 4GB XLR8 OC Gaming @ Kitguru
- Radeon Software 16.7.1 Performance Comparison @ Tech ARP
Subject: Graphics Cards | July 7, 2016 - 10:13 PM | Scott Michaud
Tagged: nvidia, GTX 1080, ea, dice, battlefield, battlefield 1
Battlefield 1 looks pretty good. To compare how it scales between its settings, DigitalFoundry took a short amount of video at 4K across all four, omnibus graphics settings: Low, Medium, High, and Ultra. These are, as should be expected for a high-end PC game, broken down into more specific categories, like lighting quality and texture filtering, but I can't blame them for not adding that many permutations to a single video. It would just be a mess.
The rendering itself doesn't change too much between settings to my eye. Higher quality settings draw more distant objects than lower ones, and increases range that level of detail falls off, too. About a third of the way into the video, they show a house from a moderate distance. The lowest quality version was almost completely devoid of shadowing and its windows would not even draw. The lighting then scaled up from there as the settings were moved progressively toward Ultra.
Image Credit: DigitalFoundry
While it's still Alpha-level code, a single GTX 1080 was getting between 50 and 60 FPS at 4K. This is a good range to be in for a G-Sync monitor, as the single-card machine doesn't need to deal with multi-GPU issues, like pacing and driver support.
Subject: Graphics Cards | July 6, 2016 - 07:15 AM | Scott Michaud
Tagged: pascal, nvidia, htc vive, GTX 1080, gtx 1070, GP104
NVIDIA is working on a fix to allow the HTC Vive to be connected to the GeForce GTX 1070 and GTX 1080 over DisplayPort. The HTC Vive apparently has the choice between HDMI and Mini DisplayPort, but the headset will not be identified when connected over that connection. Currently, the two workarounds are to connect the HTC Vive over HDMI, or use a DisplayPort to HDMI adapter if your card's HDMI output is already occupied.
It has apparently been an open issue for over a month now. That said, NVIDIA's Manuel Guzman has acknowledged the issue. Other threads claim that there are other displays that have a similar issue, and, within the last 24 hours, some users have experienced luck with modifying their motherboard's settings. I'd expect that it's something the can fix in an upcoming driver, though. For now, I guess plan your monitor outputs accordingly if you were planning on getting the HTC Vive.