Rumor: AMD Gets Exclusive Optimization for all Frostbite 3 Games

Subject: Graphics Cards | June 18, 2013 - 03:39 PM |
Tagged: radeon, nvidia, geforce, frostbite 3, ea, dice, amd

UPDATE #3

The original source article at IGN.com has been updated with some new information.  Now they are saying the agreement between AMD and EA is "non-exclusive and gamers using other components will be supported." 

The quote from an EA rep says as follows:

DICE has a partnership with AMD specifically for Battlefield 4 on PC to showcase and optimize the game for AMD hardware," an EA spokesperson said. "This does not exclude DICE from working with other partners to ensure players have a great experience across a wide set of PCs for all their titles.

END UPDATE #3

This could be a huge deal for NVIDIA and AMD in the coming months - according to a story at IGN.com, AMD has entered into an agreement with EA that will allow them exclusive rights to optimization for all games based around the Frostbite 3 engine.  That includes Battlefield 4, Mirror's Edge 2, Need for Speed Rivals and many more games due out this year and in 2014.  Here is the quote that is getting my attention:

Starting with the release of Battlefield 4, all current and future titles using the Frostbite 3 engine — Need for Speed Rivals, Mirror's Edge 2, etc. — will ship optimized exclusively for AMD GPUs and CPUs. While Nvidia-based systems will be supported, the company won't be able to develop and distribute updated drivers until after each game is released.

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Battlefield 4 will be exclusive optimized for AMD hardware.

This is huge news for AMD as the Frostbite 3 engine will be used for all EA published games going forward with the exception of sports titles.  The three mentioned above are huge but this also includes Star Wars Battlefront, Dragon Age and even the next Mass Effect so I can't really emphasize enough how big of a win this could be for AMD's marketing and developer relations teams. 

I am particularly interested in this line as well:

While Nvidia-based systems will be supported, the company won't be able to develop and distribute updated drivers until after each game is released.

The world of PC optimizations and partnerships has been around for a long time so this isn't a huge surprise for anyone that follows PC gaming.  What is bothersome to me is that both EA and AMD are saying are rumored to have agreed that NVIDIA won't get access to the game as it is being developed - something that is CRUCIAL for day-of driver releases and performance tweaks for GeForce card owners.  In most cases, both AMD and NVIDIA developer relations teams get early access to game builds for PC titles in order to validate compatibility and to improve performance of these games for the public release.  Without these builds, NVIDIA would be at a big disadvantage.  This is exactly what happend with the recent Tomb Raider release.

UPDATE

AMD called me to reiterate their stance that competition does not automatically mean cutting out the other guy.  In the Tomb Raider story linked above, Neil Robison, AMD's Senior Director of Consumer and Graphics Alliances, states quite plainly: "The thing that angers me the most is when I see a request to debilitate a game. I understand winning, I get that, and I understand aggressive companies, I get that. Why would you ever want to introduce a feature on purpose that would make a game not good for half the gaming audience?"

So what do we take away from that statement, made in a story published in March, and today's rumor?  We have to take AMD at its word until we see solid evidence otherwise, or enough cases of this occurring to feel like I am being duped but AMD wants us all to know that they are playing the game the "right way."  That stance just happens to be counter to this rumor. 

END UPDATE

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NVIDIA had performance and compatibility issues with Tomb Raider upon release.

The irony in all of this is that AMD has been accusing NVIDIA of doing this exact thing for years - though without any public statements from developers, publishers or NVIDIA.  When Batman: Arkham Asylum was launched AMD basically said that NVIDIA had locked them out of supporting antialiasing.  In 2008, Assassin's Creed dropped DX 10.1 support supposedly because NVIDIA asked them too, who didn't have support for it at the time in GeForce cards.  Or even that NVIDIA was disabling cores for PhysX CPU support to help prop up GeForce sales.  At the time, AMD PR spun this as the worst possible thing for a company to do in the name of gamers, that is was bad for the industry, etc.  But times change as opportunity changes.

The cold truth is that this is why AMD decided to take the chance that NVIDIA was allegedly unwilling to and take the console design wins that are often noted as being "bad business."  If settling for razor thin margins on the consoles is a risk, the reward that AMD is hoping to get is exactly this: benefits in other markets thanks to better relationships with game developers.

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Will the advantage be with AMD thanks to PS4 and Xbox One hardware?

At E3 I spoke in-depth with both NVIDIA and AMD executives about this debate and as you might expect both have very different opinions about what is going to transpire in the next 12-24 months.  AMD views this advantage (being in the consoles) as the big bet that is going to pay off for the more profitable PC space.  NVIDIA thinks that AMD still doesn't have what it takes to truly support developers in the long run and they don't have the engineers to innovate on the technology side.  In my view, having Radeon-based processors in the Xbox One and Playstation 4 (as well as the Wii U I guess) gives AMD a head start but won't win them the race for the hearts and minds of PC gamers. There is still a lot of work to be done for that.

Before this story broke I was planning on outlining another editorial on this subject and it looks like it just got promoted to a top priority.  There appear to be a lot of proverbial shoes left to drop in this battle, but it definitely needs more research and discussion. 

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Remember the issues with Batman: Arkham Asylum?  I do.

I asked both NVIDIA and AMD for feedback on this story but only AMD has replied thus far.  Robert Hallock, PR manager for gaming and graphics, Graphics Business Unit at AMD sent me this:

It makes sense that game developers would focus on AMD hardware with AMD hardware being the backbone of the next console generation. At this time, though, our relationship with EA is exclusively focused on Battlefield 4 and its hardware optimizations for AMD CPUs, GPUs and APUs.

Not much there, but he is also not denying of the original report coming from IGN.  It might just be too early for a more official statement.  I will update this story with information from NVIDIA if I hear anything else.

What do YOU think about this announcement though?  Is this good news for AMD and bad news for NVIDIA?  Is it good or bad for the gamer and in particular, the PC gamer?  Your input will help guide or upcoming continued talks with NVIDIA and AMD on the subject. 

UPDATE #2

Just so we all have some clarification on this and on the potential for validity of the rumor, this is where I sourced the story from this afternoon:

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END UPDATE #2

 

Source: IGN

June 18, 2013 | 04:36 PM - Posted by pdjblum

nvidia's reaction makes it seem as if they are concerned. Instead of saying something positive about their engineers ability to handily address this disadvantage, they disparage the engineers at AMD. If they were confident in their ability to deal with this adversity, they would not have had to disparage AMD. Of course, I am still reeling from the price they put on the 780, which should have been priced at the introductory price of the 680. Instead they gave us another cut down version, the 770, at that price point.

Ryan, can you please have Lee look at the comments on his review and reply when appropriate?

June 18, 2013 | 06:07 PM - Posted by Ryan Shrout

Thanks for your comments!  

Lee is out of town for a couple weeks but I'll take a look and see if its anything I can answer...

June 18, 2013 | 06:35 PM - Posted by pdjblum

thanks mon

June 18, 2013 | 11:00 PM - Posted by psoomah (not verified)

Just to point out the obvious, AMD is hoolding a handful of aces this generation, both the consoles AND the coming Kaveri, and has absolutely no need to 'lock out' Nvidia or alienate a segment of their market.

Nor has that been their style.

That story had bogus stamped all over it.

June 18, 2013 | 11:22 PM - Posted by psoomah (not verified)

And paints your thought process and wording in your article as puzzling at best.

You 'jumped een it' when logic dictated a cautious and skeptical approach.

If you are truly honest you will admit bias was present, even if unconsciously.

June 19, 2013 | 12:45 AM - Posted by psoomah (not verified)

UPDATE: Looks like Nvidia is getting out of the chip design/hardware business.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/graphics/display/20130618193824_Nvidia_Set_...

That certainly puts the game developer's/publishers actions in 'perspective'.

June 19, 2013 | 02:10 PM - Posted by Ryan Shrout

Uhh...I don't think so.

June 18, 2013 | 04:36 PM - Posted by windwalker

Good for AMD!
If there are clear indications that Nvidia has been doing the same thing for years why are you painting AMD as the bad guy for joining in?

June 18, 2013 | 06:08 PM - Posted by Ryan Shrout

If AMD is doing it, then they should be, don't you agree? I painted NVIDIA that way during the old days as well...and how many times have I bashed on PhysX??

June 18, 2013 | 06:42 PM - Posted by arbiter

Having a game designed for 1 gpu over another is 1 thing but, "While Nvidia-based systems will be supported, the company won't be able to develop and distribute updated drivers until after each game is released.". When 1 side is not getting the game til after release to optimize their drivers for game is another matter all together. This is turning in to same thing as tomb raider release, Nvidia was left outta the final code for the game til release date.

Ryan with least PhysX, it can be turned off in games.

June 18, 2013 | 10:47 PM - Posted by Jules (not verified)

You don't seem to understand Developers optimized for AMD out of sheer necessity.

In order to make a game on console then port it to PC, they need to optimized it for GCN and APU. And whatever progress made on console are ported directly to PC.

Where's NVDA when the console bidding wars started?

June 19, 2013 | 12:21 AM - Posted by mLocke

Not much of a port when the next generation of consoles run on x86-64 hardware now, not Cell Broadband Engine Architecture found in PS3 or PowerPC based chips in the 360. It is easy to argue that perhaps the next generation of games will see more PC to console ports than the other way around.

June 19, 2013 | 03:11 PM - Posted by arbiter

you forget APEX/PhysX is ALSO in the consoles as well.

June 19, 2013 | 01:30 AM - Posted by HeavyG (not verified)

My issue here is that MANY games have been ruined at release time due to poor driver support. When I pre-order a game or purchase it on the release date, I expect it to work on release day. If it does not work due to driver incompatibility, publishers had better be willing to give refunds.

Tomb Raider took weeks to fix. While my friends were able to play the game and talk about it with excitement, I was forced to wait weeks to play it. By the time the driver issues were resolved, I had moved on to other new releases and games in my catalog.

When the game developer is at fault, that is one thing, but when it is because they don't allow the hardware vendors ample time to provide driver support, I have a problem. I am the consumer of both the hardware and the software, and I am paying for it in the end because one company wants to competitive advantage.

And seriously... doesn't EA have enough problems getting their games to work on release day? Why cause even more problems? This us just stupid.

June 22, 2013 | 05:21 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

The hypocrisy of AMD fans is mind boggling.

They screamed and screamed and screamed and made excuses for bad AMD drivers over it for years and years, while corporate pig whistled sweet nothings about ethics into their gullible flappy eared noggins.

Then of course we saw AMD was far, far worse with wrecking game code for the superior opposition. In fact, nVidia never had to wreck anything as the AMD driver team is still small and pathetic and lacking in talent and focus.

What happened was AMD and it's crazed fanboy base DEMANDED free PhysX and free AA support and "open source" drivers that they wanted nVidia to spend BILLIONS developing then hand to them on a freeloader welfare platter.

Well, AMD has decided after their years of shrouded begging for freebies with PR stunts their dimwitted raging emotard active fanbase swallowed with psychotic lies regurgitated, that they will assume the actual criminal and immoraland unethical misconduct they falsely accused nVidia of doing.
AND IT WON'T MATTER

nVidia will have drivers a rockin' in a day or two or a few weeks.

AMD's evil hypocrisy will backfire, and it will be clear to those with 2 brain cells to rub together that AMD's endless whining was merely EPIC CATALYST MAKER DRIVER FAILURE all along...

Way to go AMD,
"Become the Evil you created in your own EPIC FAIL fanboy brain. "

June 18, 2013 | 04:58 PM - Posted by Jules (not verified)

One of the reasons could be JHH's "I am holier than thou" attitude toward business partners. Microsoft, Sony, TSMC, various tablet makers have all been blame for one reason to another by Jensen for number of reasons on different occasions.

And of course, nVidia is not to be blamed...

I remember some nVidia supporter keep saying the console market's margins are too thin, there no money to be made on consoles, etc...

Well, jokes on them! Having a complete gaming ecosystem PC-consoles-PC is called a "Vision". Something nVidia lacks atm.

June 18, 2013 | 05:00 PM - Posted by 3dfxrain (not verified)

Don't underestimate nvidia guys. They are to be considered seriously just like anything else.

June 18, 2013 | 10:51 PM - Posted by psoomah (not verified)

Nvidia is a dead x86 graphics co. walking.

What processor do you think Microsoft will choose for it's coming Xbox brand tablets, laptops and, probably, all-in-ones?

Gabe Newell said getting developers on board was critical to the success of Steam Box. When Gabe polled the developers as to what hardware they wanted to see in Steam Box, guess which processor they chose?

This is all about KAVERI ... the HSA FUTURE of AMD. AMD wants a handful of top AAA games highly optimized fro Kaveri, which is releasing in the same time frame as the consoles. Wht they are looking for is to make a big splash and gaming benchmarks that absolutely destroy Intel and Intel/Nvidia in gaming at comparable price points.

Adobe is clearly getting fully on board with AMD and HSA APUs.

It's clear game developers/publishers and the professional market are increasingly seeing HSA as a future winner and AMD APUs as the pinnacle of HSA implementation.

June 19, 2013 | 12:17 AM - Posted by mLocke

I was under the impression that Steam Box is essentially a build standard and not an actual platform that Valve is looking to build.

You can build a Steam Box right now by loading up an HTPC with Linux and forcing Steam to launch in Big Picture Mode when the machine is started.

June 19, 2013 | 04:19 AM - Posted by Max KreFey
...that absolutely destroy Intel and Intel/Nvidia in gaming at comparable price points.

What you did there, I see it.

June 18, 2013 | 05:04 PM - Posted by OneAgainstOne (not verified)

Terrible news for PC gaming imo if this is true, great for AMD obviously but we aren't AMD we are the consumer. This will probably hurt the industry again for some time to come as it looked like we may be potentially past this BS style of economics. I can see some people being turned off by this and just buying one of the new consoles now. They'll probably be about the same price as the new upcoming decent vid cards anyway but again its a win for AMD as like you said the consoles are full of AMD hardware.
I really hope this turns out to be false though and we have these companies actually competing technologically again rather then with this unfortunate strategy that Nvidia did start. Which basically comes down to who will pay the most to EA or Ubisoft or whoever to use there hardware first and exclude the other guys and there countless users.

June 18, 2013 | 10:55 PM - Posted by psoomah (not verified)

So it hurts consumers if their future $149 Kaveri provides a next gen gaming experience comparable to a current $500 Intel/Nvidia solution how?

June 19, 2013 | 04:38 AM - Posted by Max KreFey

Thinking that $150 AMD APU will provide same experience as $200 Intel CPU and $300 Nvidia discrete card is very optimistic, to say the least. Code optimization is not a way to obtain unobtainium, it will make something work better on particular hardware, but it will not break laws of physics and such.

June 19, 2013 | 03:18 PM - Posted by arbiter

Yea i will correct his statement, "and $150 Nvidia gpu". Cause gpu in the new consoles is 7790 range card and nvidia 650ti boost card beats it decently. As for fact cpu is 8 threads don't think games will be using more then 4 of them least for next few years. Probably gonna be least 3-5years before they start getting past the 4 cores used market and even then AMD only to keep up with intel needs to use all 8.

June 19, 2013 | 03:18 PM - Posted by arbiter

Yea i will correct his statement, "and $150 Nvidia gpu". Cause gpu in the new consoles is 7790 range card and nvidia 650ti boost card beats it decently. As for fact cpu is 8 threads don't think games will be using more then 4 of them least for next few years. Probably gonna be least 3-5years before they start getting past the 4 cores used market and even then AMD only to keep up with intel needs to use all 8.

June 18, 2013 | 05:24 PM - Posted by tony (not verified)

Ohwell guess I won't be playing them on my Intel Nvidia rig

June 18, 2013 | 06:11 PM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

After seeing how poorly AMD does at framerating and their terrible drivers , I`m going NVIDIA.

June 18, 2013 | 06:23 PM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

AMD...BITE me.

June 18, 2013 | 06:24 PM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

INTVIDIA FTW !

June 18, 2013 | 07:04 PM - Posted by arbiter

Well I call this biggest load of shit ever.

Hey EA, you are already seen on top of one the most hated companies, this just justifies it more.

"The irony in all of this is that AMD has been accusing NVIDIA of doing this exact thing for years - though without any public statements from developers, publishers or NVIDIA."

where they any games that AMD was locked outta getting before the official release date?

With this EA is already hated by a lot of people, now about every Nvidia GPU owner is added to that list that weren't on it. People that hated in Nvidia cause they believe they did this, now its AMD doing outright blatantly in public eye. Just a wonder if some hate will start to shift to AMD as they are not the hypocrite's. People go after Nvidia about how physx don't work on AMD cards, which amd claims foul. I doubt AMD didn't intentionally make tressfx opencl code cause they knew they had a clear advantage in that field.

June 18, 2013 | 07:48 PM - Posted by Nilbog

He mentions one in the article... Batman: Arkham Asylum

June 22, 2013 | 05:34 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

AMD claimed on HEXUS with their official that "he had the best amd catalyst makers on it and they wouldwritetheir own AA code shortly (do their OWN work instead of being a demanding low self esteem leeching welfare queen thief from their competiition ).

Well, we all know how that turned out - AMD saw it's stupid fanboy base would accept lies and treachery from AMD while kissing their backside and singing what sweet spring aroma.

So now AMD can really be evil they claimed they never would be out in the open, the fanboy base is as crazed and as blind as ever.

Worse yet, nVidia's excellent driver team won't have a problem delivering drivers very quickly - see that's why it's okay for AMD to be whining liars for years and then be the evil they made up in their PR stunts - BECAUSE THEY SUCK SO BADLY THEY THINK THEY "DESERVE HELP" FROM THE BILLIONS IN THE BANK nVidia !

LOL - It's true, so true, the whining, disgusting, broke welfare queen AMD, always whining and crying about the successful rich man with awesome hardware, the nVidia !

June 22, 2013 | 05:34 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

AMD claimed on HEXUS with their official that "he had the best amd catalyst makers on it and they wouldwritetheir own AA code shortly (do their OWN work instead of being a demanding low self esteem leeching welfare queen thief from their competiition ).

Well, we all know how that turned out - AMD saw it's stupid fanboy base would accept lies and treachery from AMD while kissing their backside and singing what sweet spring aroma.

So now AMD can really be evil they claimed they never would be out in the open, the fanboy base is as crazed and as blind as ever.

Worse yet, nVidia's excellent driver team won't have a problem delivering drivers very quickly - see that's why it's okay for AMD to be whining liars for years and then be the evil they made up in their PR stunts - BECAUSE THEY SUCK SO BADLY THEY THINK THEY "DESERVE HELP" FROM THE BILLIONS IN THE BANK nVidia !

LOL - It's true, so true, the whining, disgusting, broke welfare queen AMD, always whining and crying about the successful rich man with awesome hardware, the nVidia !

June 18, 2013 | 07:46 PM - Posted by Nilbog

I wanted to point out that on one of the BF4 pages (i'm trying to find a link for you) on the bottom of the page it has a AMD logo and says "official hardware partner" beneath it. Kind of a telling sign don't you think?

This kinda pisses me off. They shouldn't bitch about NVIDIA doing it, then go do the same thing.

This seems anti-competitive to me, is that just me? Isn't that illegal in the US?

This also seems like an extra douche move after NVIDIA decided to bring Apex particle support to the consoles. Yeah, its kinda silly, and there are other ways of doing about the same stuff now. Its mostly eye candy stuff that very few people notice, but NVIDIA didn't have to do that, and i thought it was cool of them to do that. Now AMD looks like the asshole.

June 22, 2013 | 05:39 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

AMD always has been the loser asshole welfare crybaby hypocrite queen, you're just finally noticing it, just part of it, but it's a start.

( remember the other whine about open source - then AMD hard drivered their Winzip exclusive, and we saw Winzip ! benchmarks... LOL )

AMD is a crybaby hypocrite liar. Always.

June 18, 2013 | 08:45 PM - Posted by mLocke

I really could not care less about this. Most Triple-A titles that are day one purchases end up being $60 beta tests, even with in house optimization. I can almost guarantee that every Frostbite powered game will release buggy as hell, no matter what hardware you run it on.

If people would stop preordering games because some marketing guy made a shiny trailer, this would have no positive or negative effect on anyone's bottom line. However people are going to continue to preorder games, and games like Aliens: Colonial Marines will be skyrocketed to the top of the Steam top sellers list for the week it was released.

I'll stick to smaller, PC-centric developers who care more about their consumers and maintaining a reputation among gamers instead of their bottom line.

June 18, 2013 | 09:26 PM - Posted by psoomah (not verified)

Optimised most specifically for HSA Kaveri and beyond. Third party publishers will ALREADY be optimizing their games for Sony's straight up PC like AMD HSA APU, it's mainly a matter of tweaking that code and just INCLUDING it in their PC ports.

It will allow Kaveri and it's sucessors to box WAY above their weight on games so supported, which will, over time, be almost all of them. Just as almost all AAA titles are currently Gaming Evolved.

For developers it's a nearly no cost method of putting a MUCH higher quality gaming experience onto mainstream and low cost computers which will translate into substantially higher game sales.

For gamers it's a way to get a quality gaming experience for cheap and as the full HSA Kaveri will be additive and compatible with ALL 8xxx GPU boards, the upgrade path will unbeatable.

There's going to be some PR backpedaling going on here but that will be temporary. AMD optimization is inevitable, it's built into the 'recipe' as it were, and it will improve and expand over time.

Nvidia being totally locked out of the next gen consoles wasn't without cost.

Just to point out, most next gen games won't be 'exclusively optimized for AMD', but, with possibly a few exceptions, they will be far MORE optimized for AMD APUs and GCN GPUs than they are for Nvidia GPUs.

Kaveri and the next gen consoles are releasing at the same time = Kaveri and the next gen console chips were being developed on the same timeline = AMD knew exactly what both Sony and Microsoft put in their chips = AMD was perfectly positioned to tweak Kaveri to make it as compatible as possible with those chips and hence as easy as possible for
game developers to translate their console optimizations to AMD's Kaveri and beyond chips.

Keep in mind AMD is providing not only all the hardware, but also the MIDDLEWARE for the consoles. What they are doing with Dice they are surely doing with other developers and for other game engines.

As AMD software and toolsets are developed and optimized over time there will be almost no barrier or cost for game developers and publishers to highly optimize for Kaveri and it's successors and every financial incentive to do so.

Microsoft very likely has plans to make Xbox One a platform that will include gaming centric 'Xbox' laptops and tablets and maybe even all-in-one desktops. And with AMD developing ARM based APUs, that would also be covered. All fully locked down of course. With next gen games already optimized for AMD APUs, Temash, Kabini, Kaveri and their successors would be a perfect fit for those devices.

Steam Box is still an unknown, but with games already optimized to AMD APUs, Kaveri would be the obvious go to chip for Valve, particularly as Gabe emphasized how vitally important it was to get game developers on board to make Steam Box a success, which surely included Gabe asking them what they wanted to see in Steam Box. That's a no brainer. In relation to this, there was a Digital Foundry article a while back where they asked a number of game developers which GPU they though was more 'future proof', AMD or Nvidia. Without exception they chose AMD.

THAT's what game developers and publishers, who would, of necessity, be aware of what Microsoft and Valve are going to do, are looking at. A gaming landscape with AMD APU dominated consoles, Microsoft Xbox brand devices and Steam Box.

Logically, this is the most probable scenario and it's a scenario that casts a very dark shadow over Nvidia's FUTURE in the x86 gaming space.

Consider the Laura Croft driver restriction and the above report the opening shots across Nvidia's bow presaging where it's game developer and publisher relations are headed.

June 22, 2013 | 05:47 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

Since consoles have native hardware driven systems, and discrete video cards have an entirely different arch and driver, YOU'RE GOING ON ABOUT AN INCORRECT FANTASY.

I'll kind of maybe go with you on "developer relations" maybe having and AMD advantage, but when AMD is broke and near teamless it might have an opposite effect - developers HATING THEM - overworked and underpaid AMD skeleton staff help - near nothing...

Then nVidia walks in with the refreshing breath of EXCELLENCE and lots of green. Things could be real shiny real quickly.

That's bad for AMD - as it all usually is.

June 18, 2013 | 09:37 PM - Posted by ThorAxe

Much ado about nothing? Does this mean AMD is locked into it's current architecture for the next 7+ years?

If AMD do bring out a new architecture then they lose some of the inherent console optimisations. If they don't release new architecture then they risk falling far behind Nvidia.

AMD are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

June 22, 2013 | 05:58 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

Thinking beyond the amd tardbox is not allowed !

June 18, 2013 | 10:14 PM - Posted by Jules (not verified)

Need to point out NVDA is shifting their focus onto emerging markets, such as smartphone/tablet market and high performance processors for servers. Very lucrative, yet very illusive.

Tegra, Tesla, nVidia Shield. That's their focus now, Tegra 4i would have made a mark in mobile space if it weren't delay till 1Q 2014.

PC, console gamers were simply "let go" so to speak.

June 22, 2013 | 05:57 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

Wut ?!

nVidia let PC gamers go ? LOL

Did you notice the titan, the 780 770 and coming 760 ?

LOL -amd is a tiny weak joke of a stuttering jerky loser...

Man, we heard that same CRAP with the nVidia 500 series now the GTX580 IS THE ONLY ONE LEFT IN THE HIGH END CHARTS TO THIS DAY !
rofl -"nVidia abandoned gamers with their compute GTX580!" the IDIOT amd fanboys screamed and screamed....

Cripes we had the dang meme surging through forums and certain red centric raging reviewer sites...

YEP - amd fanboys, terribly and completely INCORRECT as usual.

I just saw the GTX580 in like 7 of 8 Titan / 780 770 reviews, AND NO EQUIVALENT AMD CARD from that generation because it doesn't even REGISTER.
The 7970GE made a losing showing, yes it beat only the prior gen 580, but point is,THE 580 IS STILL VIABLE !
LOL

So, repeating the same mistake, the amd fanboy forte no doubt,never learning, never paying attention, proclaiming bald faced turd swill only another fool would believe, a sort of amd fanboy mental ward sparkout for fellow travellers.

LOL - thanks for the laughs

June 18, 2013 | 11:21 PM - Posted by ThorAxe

Nividia primary business is GPUs, it is where it sources the vast majority it's revenue and has the highest margins. They currently have a 64% market share and would be extremely foolish to cut it loose.

From what I have read NVIDIA's GTX line of graphic-card sales is going strong and the company is trying to expand operations in the division.

Tegra etc are merely side projects to hedge their bets in case they lose their dominance of the AIB market.

June 18, 2013 | 11:30 PM - Posted by psoomah (not verified)

Nvidia's problem is FUTURE sales, following the next gen consoles and Kaveri releases.

The fully HSA Kaveri graphics will be additive to GCN AIBs making it highly desirable to pair and AMD AIB with Kaveri.

You can bet your bottom dollar the FOCUS of that AMD optimization on next gen games is Kaveri and the GCN 8xxx line of AIB cards.

June 19, 2013 | 02:32 AM - Posted by ThorAxe

Kaveri requires new FM2+ motherboards to work. I am not sure that anyone is going to buy a FM2+ board, APU and then a discrete graphics card. What would be the point?

We have seen how well Crossfire works on identical GPUs (sacrcasm intended) the performance gains from pairing and AIB with Kaveri will likely provide marginal performance improvements. I suppose anythings possible but history says it's doubtful.

June 19, 2013 | 03:26 PM - Posted by arbiter

Put on top of that, FM2 cpu's atm are only quad core cpu's. Which all the little ram/cpu shared optimization's built in to the console cpu probably only work on those. well if game is optimized for 8 core part well shouldn't need to say more on performance wise how far AMD is behind intel.

June 20, 2013 | 09:18 PM - Posted by Jules (not verified)

Next gen is optimized for 8 cores because programmers understand the importance to divide workload evenly on all 8 cores. Let's face it, it's about time programmers take better use of CPU cores.

That is where AMD Heterogeneous System Architecture are preferred instead of Intel cores. With their very good balance between CPU and GPU.

Digital Foundry: Let's talk about next-gen console. What's your take on the general design in terms of CPU and graphics processing power?

Oles Shishkovstov: We are talking PS4, right? I am very excited about both CPU and GPU. Jaguar is a pretty well-balanced out-of-order core and there are eight of them inside. I always wanted a lot of relatively-low-power cores instead of single super-high-performance one, because it's easier to simply parallelise something instead of changing core-algorithms or chasing every cycle inside critical code segment (not that we don't do that, but very often we can avoid it).

Many beefier cores would be even better, but then we'll be left without a GPU! With regards the graphics core, it's great, simply great. It's a modern-age high-performance compute device with unified memory and multiple compute-contexts. The possibilities of CPU-GPU-CPU communication are endless, we can easily expect games doing, for example, AI pathfinding/route planning executing on GPU to become a common thing.

Digital Foundry vs. 4A's Oles Shishkovstov on technological innovation, PlayStation 3 and the incredible potential of the next-gen consoles.

June 22, 2013 | 06:30 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

There it is again,the amd fanboy fantasy of the last decade that amd is just on the brink, of "totally destroying nvidia !"

R O F L M A O

We can bet your bottom dollar, a very bottom of the barrel dollar that you're wrong again, like the last 50 times amd fanboy fanaticism took over your mental faculties and the exuded brainfart notched up globull warming.

June 19, 2013 | 10:58 AM - Posted by DeadOfKnight

To all the fanboys out there of AMD, NVIDIA, or Intel, all I have to say is this: Sure, AMD might be the least evil technology leader of today, but it's easy for them to portray that facade as the underdog. If they can't get the market share, they can try to win the hearts and minds of people who will hopefully have their back during the hard times and when they decide to take big risks. From what I see here, they've been pretty successful at this. The AMD fanboys have been particularly loud and outspoken on every thread I have seen that may show AMD in a bad light.

However, don't think for a second that AMD is your friend. None of these companies are your friend. They have two priorities: margin and growth. If they were truly about the consumer they would be content with a very modest maintenance of these numbers and continue to push prices down, but they're not content with that and they never will be. They are not nonprofit organizations. So go ahead and be fanboys and toot your little horn that you're supporting the lesser of two evils who is destined to have a comeback and take on the performance crown with greater ethical behavior. If the day comes that they are top dog, mark my words, all they will care about is staying top dog.

This is much the same with everyone acting like Sony is the savior of freedom on the consoles. Really? Were they the savior of freedom when they were prosecuting individuals for modding their hardware? Were they the savior of freedom when they decided to skimp out of the protection of your data? Were they the savior of freedom AT ALL during the lifespan of the PS3? No. They saw the direction the consoles were heading and they decided to play the "good guy" during this transition period to win back the hearts and minds of everyone who had previously gone to MS.

All I see are people predicting that the Xbone is going to be a complete and utter failure, but I don't think this is true at all. They are going to have some difficulty during this pain period at the start, but they are the ones paving the way in the direction that the entire industry wants to go in, Sony included. I would be surprised if Sony doesn't institute similar DRM policies in the future after they've secured a majority of customers on their hardware. I would be absolutely shocked if they didn't have such policies with the advent of the next generation platforms.

Again, corporations are not your friends. Once you get that through your thick skulls, the better.

June 19, 2013 | 11:31 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

Sorry Ryan but you wrote this twice: "The thing that angers me the most is when I see a request to debilitate a game. I understand winning, I get that, and I understand aggressive companies, I get that. Why would you ever want to introduce a feature on purpose that would make a game not good for half the gaming audience?" it's ok for me but other people might see it as unprofessional. Just thought you should know.

June 19, 2013 | 12:18 PM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

"The irony in all of this is that AMD has been accusing NVIDIA of doing this exact thing for years - though without any public statements from developers, publishers or NVIDIA."

i didn't know that Nvidia was evil in the past but i am not saying that AMD is doing good now ...

but i think AMD should lunch something good after the the consoles sales to win the pc gamers ..

June 22, 2013 | 06:11 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

I guess you missed the part about AMD accusing nVidia but having no evidence from any quarter...

See AMD just flapped their lips, and they are so used to flapping their lips, they just flapped em some more this time with their "proud" announcement of the crimes they will commit against gamers in direct violation of their posted and obviously A BIG FAT LIE "Gamers Manifesto". (they're commies)

June 19, 2013 | 07:28 PM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

I think that AMD is willing to innovate & do the right thing for the right price, if they come with a 8970 that is priced @ $550 like the 7970 was originally & performing close or on par with 780 maybe better, I think they can give Nvidia (since they are green with envy)the finger so they could be sucking on it as they please. Since they got some important people back some from Intel & so forth maybe it is because they. If NVidia is trying to tell me well if the dumbasses want to pay for it why not (cause the little leprechaun wants his hands in your pockets & want to reinvent how they price GPU) AMD started with 7970 with $550 these guys are thinking they can charge $500 for software optimizations (fucking PhysX TXAA, Titan "you're not brainwashing me") that they invest a ton on. AMD gave you raw power, they should name their 8970 "BIG DICK" as the finger to Nvidia. Yeah Nvidia would throw the fact they got SLI covered with the fact Crossfire is not optimized as per Ryan's Frame Rating. But they are working on it & maybe they are not releasing the 8970 yet because they are trying to hardware support that into their boards. As far as Intel goes they are working on opting them with the 220W part & they don't want to give it to enthusiast because they are afraid of having too much damage control after they would get most chips returned when with Maingear they can control some of the warranty waving part of things, what's wrong with being cautious. I do praise them for trying something though rather then nothing since this would probably cost them more than make the money(they could just sit on their asses & do nothing about it). They are challenging & them working together with the developers I think would benefit them tremendously since Intel & Nvidia has been optimizing their parts for ages (unfair competition, how do you like the taste of that Nvidia) Jen-Hsun Huang use to work for AMD witch makes him hating them even more. He had some good visions & works with some professional personnel(120hz movies instead of 24fps(Hz), SLI optimization, PhysX, TXAA). Too bad it doesn't like to share. I don't have any hate against them I just think if AMD will do better will push Nvidia to do even better for a better price & Nvidia fans will get to pay less for the gear they are getting( what's wrong with saving some money) guess who they will have to thank for that AMD maybe. AMD is a small & nimble company but you got to love them though, if they get a little closer with the 28Nm parts processors I think they would be able to compete with Intel at some point & that get's me exited(I got a Sandy bridge E, Hasswel). If they get closer I will consider going all out AMD if they get their optimization to the niche they were hoping with spider, now that the got developers on their side I think they should go all out. Intel doesn't make good graphics cards & Nvidia doesn't make good x86 CPUs if you except the Shield(Tegra 4, ARM). I think they hold some good cards in their hands now & everybody is afraid they would get a bit more of the pie they already had their hands into (shame on you Intel & Nvidia, you just don't like to share don't you, just want to make sure your investors are rooting for you, you really don't get the fact that you can pee on all of your investors if you don't have consumers witch are you're real investors, they invest in your company every time they purchase anything). I think AMD wants to send a message to the consumers that they always cared about them but now they do for the long run. I like the approach of them looking far in the future & not live just in the now. You always forget that AMD helps with their GPU in compute workloads witch Nvidia cheated with their Kepler cards by cutting that part out & thought that they should throw more of their chips on the 3D side of things(helping games), all AMD needs to do is put a it more 3D side a bit less compute since the people are not ready for that yet throw in a bit of software optimizations & they would be right on par with Nvidia or maybe even exceed them for that matter. Some of their team are probably focused too much on the future & not on the now, so they shift direction to deal with crossfire issues, kicking their CPUs into higher gear & get back @ what they do best witch is innovation. Compute wise Nvidia is lagging & for them to catch up on that they have to loose some dearly beloved 3D performance. 4.3 billion transistor count on HD 7970Ghz, 3.5 billion on the GTX 770, 7.1 billion on the 780, Titan. Nvidia did good with their GTX 680 with just software optimizations & getting some of those transistors working for 3D more than compute since they didn't see any value in that. AMD had the Eyefinity locked down & gave you more ram for about the same price as Nvidia & now they are charging you $250 for twice the transistors & same amount of ram. 8970 should have 5.5 ("http://www.chiploco.com/amd-radeon-hd-8000-series-specifications-24661/") transistor count. If the transistor count would be significantly less than Titan/780 & I see some actual testing of AMD cards I would be more convinced to justify the extra charge of Nvidia but if there will be similar performance of at least 780 maybe hopefully Titan I would pay $550 for 780 equivalent & as much as $700 for Titan equivalent & not a penny more & I think AMD will have a lot more to gain from sales rather than having an extreme return of their products like hence 780/Titan. I am really getting tired of writing too bad I had some work to do meanwhile.

June 22, 2013 | 06:18 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

Another amd raging fanboy... LOL

" Jen-Hsun Huang use to work for AMD witch makes him hating them even more."

Umm... that guy is co-founder of nVidia and current CEO and like a billionaire probably, so AMD could never afford him.

He might buy out AMD though.

June 20, 2013 | 08:57 AM - Posted by MarkT (not verified)

I'm just glad AMD is still breathing.

June 20, 2013 | 12:36 PM - Posted by Poci

Im guessing its just gonna be ready out of box playability with current drivers while NVidia will take a month to roll out drivers.

June 22, 2013 | 06:23 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

AMD is known to release video card arches without proper drivers, like recently , and often their Gaming Evolved games run better on nVidia cards !

So it's really fantasy time for amd fanboys.

Or overdose on some Verdetrol.

June 22, 2013 | 06:33 AM - Posted by Anonymous (not verified)

I didn't see the part where nVidia's far superior Compute Architecture and SECURE DRIVERS lead to

The NSA dropping a couple BILLION on some Titan terrorist tracking tech !

Oh well, better luck next time AMD - try to solve those hackable security issues won't you ?

June 23, 2013 | 12:08 PM - Posted by Stefenheif (not verified)

I have an AMD GPU, it has a lot of good sides. Good raw power,drivers are getting better thru the years (went nVidia from the Ti 4200 to GTX460) then I switched to a 6950.

nVidia has Physx on their side and better frame times (in general).

I must say that I deplore what AMD are doing, they are handicapping the other player because of a lack in their driver department. This is not innovation, this is stagnation. If nVidia are having better performance with somewhat lesser hardware (660 ti and 7950 as an example), it is not nVidia's fault, but AMD's since THEY DON'T HAVE good drivers.

It feels like an asthmatic runner shooting his competitors in the leg to "level" his chances.

We have to stop thinking that AMD is the defenseless underdog because people buy more cards from nVidia. That nVidia is the mean one with having Physx and trying to hurt AMD sales. They are both rogues that are trying to backstab each other.

Yes, Physx on CPU is not pretty good, since even with an OC'ed i7 980 you get huge frame rate drops in Hawken with Physx enabled, and disabling it solves that.

All we can do is to report those situations, and reviewers like the guys here at PCPer asks the companies representative some details about it, in which cases they will just look dumb trying to smooth the situation, like the deal with it guy at M$oft.

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